Do students ever really become bronze and silver level dancers?

L

LordBallroom

Member
I want everyone to know right now that I didn't come here to be a troll. While one of my first two threads was probably a bad idea to start with in terms of making a first impression, I am a genuine lover of dance and want to have civil discussions with people. I'll tell you right now that I'm a former "instructor" who left the industry disillusioned. I'm trying to have a fresh start in the industry. This being the case I'll be starting a few topics which will cover some of my biggest grips in hopes that my concerns can be aleviated. I want to believe that people who spend $20,000 on dance lessons actually get their money's worth but I haven't seen it. I can't count all the people I know that have danced for years and invested tens of thousands that have little more than a better frame to show for their investment. How is it that people can spend untold amounts of money on lessons and still can't maintain their balance when they move? Why is it that their "technique" looks barely different than the first day they came into the studio? How many students are even aware of a little something called musicality? Are dance studios really selling bronze and silver programs or are they simply selling beginner programs with more advanced foot patterns?
 
it depends on the skill of the pro...some bronze students at some studios have better technique than open students at other studios...some students are better than some teachers...as someone who spends far more than 20k a year and having spent 4 years on bronze and now in silver through gold and open (depending on the style)for a total of almost 8 years dancing, I can tell you that I am a better dancer than some teachers in my area.... my pro has consistently turned out students who can say the same and have been champions at usdc and ohio in levels bronze through open...and we are not the only place of our kind (I can think of studios in DC, Minnesota, Tennessee, and California...to name but a few... that can say the same)... I can assure you that those accomplishments do mean something and that I am perfectly capable of my own balance and musicality... but that is because I have a pro who is an exceedingly good dancer (of many decades) who is also able to articulate what he needs to articulate in order to teach... but he is not at all interested in fluff...in short,d the tea if the student wants it, and the teacher has it, YES...it happens... it can be found in lots of places... and anyone who is knowledgeable at all about major pro/am events knows it....

be forewarned; regardless of your intent, if this becomes a pro/am bashing thread it will be closed...promptly...and resurrecting it elsewhere will not be tolerated...we have done that to death
 
I have taken lessons from my instructor for 2&1/2 years. In that time, I went from someone who just wanted to learn a few steps here and there to dance socially at work related functions, to performing in a studio showcase, to just finishing my 3rd competition. So yes, it happens ALL THE TIME. I don't think any brand new student goes into ballroom dance lessons with the notion that they want to compete at all, much less at any given level. Most don't even know what that means. I think what you've experienced is most likely related to lack of quality instruction.
 
Some students eventually become teachers. If you've never really seen a student become proficient at bronze or better, you either have been at a studio with singularly unmotivated students and terrible instructors with a limited statistical sample, or you aren't really clear on what proficient bronze looks like. I know far more people taking dance lessons who have attained at least a basic bronze proficiency than have not. Competitive and social both. I know plenty of students who have spent lots of time and money on lessons who are well beyond bronze technique, competitive and social both.
 
This thread is a troll's angry and uninformed tirade against their students or the students of their 'school'.

EVERY dancer that has advanced in quality or time owes that to their education and their hard work at applying the skillset presented to them. True, the many 'levels' that some schools allow their students to wallow in (with teachers that are the 6 week wonder or sales stars rather than dance stars) make it difficult to see what true dance education results look like.

Perhaps your limited experience in the world has only allowed a view of what the training of your own school results in... sorry that you are seeing that now, but it is at least a wake up call for you; maybe you will wind up in the bigger 'pond' of true dance lovers and begin to appreciate that al dancers are students/

To see this, go outside your local school's comp (or chain comp) and look at the real world of dance. There is actually a whole organization of dancers that learn, compete, and progress to levels higher than you probably will ever even begin to achieve - it's called USA Dance. Ever heard of it? Or seen Pro Am competitions with quality of dance that approaches that of Pros?
 
"How is it that people can spend untold amounts of money on lessons and still can't maintain their balance when they move? Why is it that their "technique" looks barely different than the first day they came into the studio? How many students are even aware of a little something called musicality? Are dance studios really selling bronze and silver programs or are they simply selling beginner programs with more advanced foot patterns?"

Time for you to find another studio lol... yours and the 'programs' it sells obviously is not doing it right.
 
Bailamosdance said:
This thread is a troll's angry and uninformed tirade against their students or the students of their 'school'.

?
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The students are the last people I'm angry at. The students in the studio all loved me. I can be pretty charming when I want to be. My own students especially loved me and I had no trouble getting booked up.
 
Larinda McRaven said:
If you really think the whole think is so awful, I have no idea why you are still there...! Unless it is just the idea of getting Top Sales in your State. In which case, shame on you. Or perhaps you are still there to prove something and "beat" the pros in your studio that can actually dance... in which case shame on you still. Really, if it is such an awful environment full of bad dancers, bad teachers, and shady business practices... I think you should move on.
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I came back for a fresh start because I found a group of folks that think a little like I do and want to do something about it. I don't ever want to go back to a situation like I was in.
 
then I recommend that you find a good coach immediately and begin investing in your own skill...which will attract students desiring to acquire skill, over simply being entertained...and that you begin to harnass your self-proclaimed marketing skills into selling your skill, not your charm...because, if you want dedicated hard-working students who improve, you have to be up to the task....and if you want to see the gold standard for who you want to be when you "grow up" to be a seasoned instructor, I suggest you go to someplace where you can get a good long look at that
 
Larinda McRaven said:
First off... most of us teachers don't sell programs. That is a very "closed studio" thing to do. Pretty much if you were in the outside world you will see "programs" are only one way to run a business. I haven't sold a program in 14 years. I do however sell dance lessons. And I teach people to dance based on their ability, not on some arbitrary block of lessons with a fancy name on it like "Social Ease", although I understand and accept the benefits of that method.
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What do you sell in terms of a curriculum? People don't just pluck down money for lessons when they don't know what they're buying. Or maybe they do with someone that has name recognition like yourself.
 
it's like having visited one state and deciding the whole country sucks...and then when people say "dude, you need to go to some more states" you respond with "those couldn't be any more representative than the one I am in"....uh..well...okay then...stay there
 
LordBallroom said:
What do you sell in terms of a curriculum? People don't just pluck down money for lessons when they don't know what they're buying. Or maybe they do with someone that has name recognition like yourself.
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um...the only name recognition that works that way is that which has produced results, in which case people know exactly what they are buying
 
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