Does your teacher make you dance your routines by yourself?

[MaggieMoves]

I've danced with some women who I call Routine Girls. They don't connect with their partner properly. In one egregious example that I videoed a routine girl was so blatantly obviously not connecting with her pro during her showcase routine that she declined to have my video posted. Having danced with her, I can say that many women with only a few lessons are easier to social dance with than she.

I think it's the leader's job to live partly in the future while the follow is supposed to take care of the present moment.

To the follows who practice their routine choreography solo, how do you avoid Routine Girl Syndrome?

I've never really been a big fan of routines for this reason. At some point it just creates an exercise in doing steps, rather than actually dancing and connecting with your partner. People can generally feel this and it is noticeable even at a high level.

What I like to have are set pieces I have with my pro or partner that can be adjusted to the music... or to a crowded dance floor. Of course, this is much more relevant in Standard than Latin, but having that adjustability on the floor generally seems to help my scores.

I think the "routine girl" syndrome comes from people not willing to spend enough time on connection. That takes a long time to develop for some people.

 

[DL]

I can't fix your dancing if you are constantly on the wrong foot, going the wrong direction, or standing there doing nothing. As a teacher I would MUCH RATHER help someone learn how to DANCE their body instead of reviewing the same choreography over and over.

They're not mutually exclusive, though...

 

[cornutt]

Regarding Routine Girl Syndrome, my experience has been that most follows go through a phase of doing this in the 6-12 month time frame. Keep dancing with them and they'll break out of it as they gain more confidence in their connecting ability.

 

[DL]

actually when 2/3 of your lesson time is spent like this, you would see they are exclusive....

Me: Let's look at that pivot, it is pretty ... ahem ... rough.
Student: What pivot?
Me: The one over here!
Student: This?
Me: No, that is a weave.
Student: blank stare
Me: never mind, just dance this wall.
Student: blank stare
Me: you know... this wall... starts with the side by side part!
Student: What side by side part?
Me:

Whoa. Well, still, I want to say that they weren't mutually exclusive for *me*....

 

[chomsky]

Short version - I have different dancing modes.

Learning new choreography mode (with partner and solo, reviewing written or video choreo as needed).

Practicing existing choreography solo - working on different things at different run throughs - posture, timing, footwork, etc.

Practicing drills solo - these are great since you can work technique in as much detail as you want without worrying about it affecting following skills.

Practicing existing choreo with a partner - working on technique, working on following, working on musicality/performance, etc in various run throughs. (Sometimes working on new technique may mean less emphasis on following in the short run, depends on what the technique is and other factors.)

Practicing with partner where existing choreo is the framework, but we may or may not stick to the routine precisesly - definitely more in following mode here.

Performance mode - for competition, it's following and performance focused. The routines are still there in the background, and may or may not get executed as planned (depending on traffic and other factors).

Performance mode for showcase is a bit more focused on the sequence (since you want to end with the music, hit the highlights, etc, and are hoping to perform the planned sequence without really altering it), but still trying to follow/be responsive to the lead in terms of step size, expression, etc.

Social dance mode - try to be ready to follow whatever.

I've been dancing a number of years. My ability to dance differently in different circumstance and switch among the different modes has grown over time. In general, time spent in solo practice was helpful in my growth as a dancer. When I was a new dancer, I was pretty much in "trying to waltz" or "trying to cha cha" mode whether solo or with a partner or whatever.


You've mentioned newbies sometimes follow better than ladies that have had lessons. I think this is because the newbies are a clean slate. They are mostly just reacting to what is happening, they don't have the background to accidentally overthink it or be thinking about the thing their teacher was trying to fix in their last lesson, or whatever.

If you find some of the ladies that have had lessons that difficult to dance with, don't ask them to dance. But realize they are somewhere in their dance journey, and are working on things. I doubt they are trying to be bad followers, though it certainly is possible they (and/or their teachers) don't put a high priority on connection and following skills. Following well is hard, as is leading. Cut those having difficulty with it some slack.

My God, this is so so so me...after three and a half years, I am back to zero and feel exactly like all the above when I follow. Thanks for looking into my soul raindance!

 

[chomsky]

Regarding Routine Girl Syndrome, my experience has been that most follows go through a phase of doing this in the 6-12 month time frame. Keep dancing with them and they'll break out of it as they gain more confidence in their connecting ability.

Fingers crossed, it'll work! (I am joking! I know it does!!!It is indeed a confidence thing!)

 

[Mengu]

Me:

Out of curiosity, is it less , to have to say: keep you right side up, more space in the arm, turn your leg in, head more to the left, etc... for the thousandth time?

 

[snapdancer]

Regarding Routine Girl Syndrome, my experience has been that most follows go through a phase of doing this in the 6-12 month time frame.

I haven't noticed this. The Routine Girls I know have been dancing for quite some time and the Syndrome is well entrenched in them. My observations including an occasional dance over several years.

Speculating that maybe this is a byproduct of how they are taught. Does your studio use packages/programs? Locally most instructors are independent and students of the one national franchisee do not mix in the general dance community.

I think solo practice is best used for basic movements, to work on issues such as posture and frame falling apart when moving to another foot.

 

[Mr 4 styles]

My pros will say.." do it solo" to look a parts of routines. That how I learned to say "do it again" in Japanese

 

[IndyLady]

Out of curiosity, is it less , to have to say: keep you right side up, more space in the arm, turn your leg in, head more to the left, etc... for the thousandth time?

LOL. I joke to people that I'm still paying instructors to tell me the same things they were telling me when I started 10 years ago: take smaller steps, stand up straight, less muscle, etc.

 

[DanceMentor]

My pros will say.." do it solo" to look a parts of routines. That how I learned to say "do it again" in Japanese

Guessing that would be (phonetically):
Mo y-Kai
Another Drink is:
Mo y-pai

 

[flying_backwards]

... most open gold students are able to dance their routines by themselves.... without you're a teacher dancing it with you?

Although below gold, my rate of progress is due to willingness to practice solo. I do have a partner and we spend half our practice time joined at the hip. But we also practice side-by side, sometimes both in leader's role, sometimes each in our own role.

I also have an imaginary invisible partner for solo practice. He never makes mistakes, never interrupts, and waits patiently in the car while I shop. He does not, however, pay half the lesson costs. Before I had a partner I spent more hours with Mr. Invisible.

A large portion of lesson time is solo. Often my teacher does side-by-side with me so I can mimic his actions and timing visually. When I am following my teacher, I dance far better because I am taking from him so many queues. I do not know a figure, or a sequence of figures if I can only follow it, not dance it solo.

I disagree that it is better to practice pivots, spins, and double reverses in partnership. Both solo and together are needed. But until I can execute my own role solo I have little hope of contributing positively to the joint effort. Of course some errors become more apparent in partnership, especially in these examples.

Knowing my choreo has never kept me from following. My follow instincts run deep. And all the solo work we do in group class does not keep the ladies from following me when I test my lead by varying the choreo. So no, I do not think being able to dance solo hurts following.

 

[SmoothDancer]

Our teacher has told us that we need to be able to dance our routine individually, but has never really required us to work on it. That said, I do have my partner do her (follower) part of the routine, if only to ensure that she does the figures properly and with good technique. She has to know where and when CBM is applied, correct footwork, quality of movement, etc. And on my part, I go through the routine by myself to also remind myself to dance with clarity of direction and intention. If you can't dance the routine by yourself, then I doubt it will be much better in the partnership.

If, in partnership, she starts to dance the routine by herself, I'm quick to remind her to go with the lead and not the routine.

 

[open_mind]

I do have my partner do her (follower) part of the routine, if only to ensure that she does the figures properly and with good technique. She has to know where and when CBM is applied, correct footwork, quality of movement, etc. And on my part, I go through the routine by myself to also remind myself to dance with clarity of direction and intention. If you can't dance the routine by yourself, then I doubt it will be much better in the partnership.

If, in partnership, she starts to dance the routine by herself, I'm quick to remind her to go with the lead and not the routine.

I am a follower and had a partner like that in the past, demanding I knew where I placed my foot, where my CBM was, my line of dance, my quality. I suppose, like you, he practiced his understanding of the direction and intention. Unfortunately, when we danced together, things fell apart quickly. I knew my CBM, but he was dancing something else, he was forgetting choreography, he was going against the line of dance and it was my fault that I didn't follow his mistakes. I was encouraged to practice even more when things were especially bad. I got tired and I ended that partnership.

I am not a believer in partner dance practicing without a partner. In the very very beginning, when one just gets used to the rhythm of a particular dance or learns steps, then yes, of course practice is needed. Or when someone needs to gain more strength or balance. At a certain stage though, a couple needs to become one and just dance as one. I don't see how it could be achieved through building incorrect muscle memory of dancing solo. Obviously, it's necessary to know the basics, and I suppose it's ok to dance by yourself when you just learn the steps, but I am talking about the next level.

 

[flying_backwards]

Where I practice there are championship level couples also practicing. I see them practice solo a lot, even though they are there together. So that tells me solo practice is not just for learning new steps.