Have Reality Shows made dance better / worse / different?

[Bailamosdance]

A recent thread about the costs of private lessons brought up the comments that people actually equated the pricing of lessons with TV reality show participants with the pricing of lessons from coaches and teaches that are active in the competition world. On first glance, it seemed hard for me to reconcile the two; but it seems that people are watching these shows and seeing the choreography and execution of same as a sort of 'standard' of quality or 'finish' that can drive pricing of coaching by these folks to levels much higher than, say, the coaches that trained THEM or are the ones that are considered top level by dancers in the competitive field.

Notwithstanding the 'star factor' or the 'visibility' factor, it seems that discussing what they are doing to dance, good or bad, bears discussion. Are these shows, with fast turnaround, the need to create 'wow' using untrained amateurs and unusual musical choices, and cheering crowds bringing the dancing itself to new heights, or lowering the bar? Is the expectation of quick results changing the dancing for better, worse, or pushing it to new and more interesting places? And last of all, is something being gained or lost?

At first I personally was thinking of a way to express my disappointment in that people would look at a reality show and see someone coaching and think they were worth more than, say, a top coach in the real world - someone who is not working for a weekly prize but for the long term quality of their students and the dance world. However, at the same time, these folks on TV may be changing dance in ways that may actually affect the way competitive dance is danced and perceived by the competitors themselves... or not?

Certainly not denigrating in any way what the DWTS folks are doing (after all, sometimes it is not only a miracle they accomplish but also a wonderful portrayal of the dance world they send out to us all) but, is what they do and show relevant to the world of dance, especially in the finals and the Championships of the world?

 

[fascination]

honestly, other than at the very beginning of dwts, when I saw some uptick in social dancers, I have not seen the increase in dance reality shows translate to any differences at all in any aspect of ballroom...sure, it is possible that one could say that a greater proportion of citizens are able to talk about ballroom on a peripheral level...and many comps now have a local dwts attached to their event...other than that, I would be hard-pressed to find a single thing that I have noticed which has been effected

 

[danceronice]

I don't know about quick results, either, because when I did the math...I have one lesson a week. Not four hours a day. In terms of HOURS, compared to the average student at DWTS celeb is getting six months' worth of lessons crammed into the first four weeks.

I think it's relevant only in the sense that's the only reason a lot of people in the US know ballroom exists. I don't think the average person even knows there ARE championships, or if they do, their image of them is some vague muddle of figure skating and "Strictly Ballroom." Or the American "Shall We Dance?" (with its implications that ballroom is the refuge for the desperate and socially maladjusted and any 'normal' person would use it just to work on their 'important' relationships.)

 

[debmc]

I think it has certainly attracted more people to ballrom, and has introduced the idea of an amateur and pro dancing together. I think for non dancers, DWTS has become the 'Blackpool' for them to watch, for want of a better word. Very few outside the dance world are aware of the true champions of the various categories of professional Dancesport, but they know who the pros are on the show! I realized this even more in the past week, when one of my coworkers was trying to have a serious discussion with me about dance and asked, quite seriously, if my end goal was to be on DWTS. He was not joking, he was absolutely serious! To him, that is the goal of all aspiring ballroom dancers. I can see, then, the show promoting a false competition world that non ballroom people believe. Life imitates art? We shall see .

 

[debmc]

I don't know about quick results, either, because when I did the math...I have one lesson a week. Not four hours a day. In terms of HOURS, compared to the average student at DWTS celeb is getting six months' worth of lessons crammed into the first four weeks.

I think it's relevant only in the sense that's the only reason a lot of people in the US know ballroom exists. I don't think the average person even knows there ARE championships, or if they do, their image of them is some vague muddle of figure skating and "Strictly Ballroom." Or the American "Shall We Dance?" (with its implications that ballroom is the refuge for the desperate and socially maladjusted and any 'normal' person would use it just to work on their 'important' relationships.)

And even the movie Shall We Dance, had Richard Gere going from beginning student to open amateur competitor in weeks!

 

[debmc]

I think this 'fast track' idea to ballroom is insulting for those that have spent so many years working on it.

 

[middy]

I think it has certainly attracted more people to ballrom, and has introduced the idea of an amateur and pro dancing together. I think for non dancers, DWTS has become the 'Blackpool' for them to watch, for want of a better word. Very few outside the dance world are aware of the true champions of the various categories of professional Dancesport, but they know who the pros are on the show! I realized this even more in the past week, when one of my coworkers was trying to have a serious discussion with me about dance and asked, quite seriously, if my end goal was to be on DWTS. He was not joking, he was absolutely serious! To him, that is the goal of all aspiring ballroom dancers. I can see, then, the show promoting a false competition world that non ballroom people believe. Life imitates art? We shall see .

Yes, the most common thing I experience for people to say is "When are you going to be on Dancing with the Stars?" or "You're going to be on DwtS soon!"

Cute (sort of), but I'm a) not going to be famous and b) not going to be good enough to be a "pro" either...

One thing I see is the difference between competition-style and the more showdance-y tricks-filled style of dances on TV, but I don't see how it's directly affecting the ballroom world.

 

[stash]

I think it has certainly attracted more people to ballrom, and has introduced the idea of an amateur and pro dancing together. I think for non dancers, DWTS has become the 'Blackpool' for them to watch, for want of a better word. Very few outside the dance world are aware of the true champions of the various categories of professional Dancesport, but they know who the pros are on the show! I realized this even more in the past week, when one of my coworkers was trying to have a serious discussion with me about dance and asked, quite seriously, if my end goal was to be on DWTS. He was not joking, he was absolutely serious! To him, that is the goal of all aspiring ballroom dancers. I can see, then, the show promoting a false competition world that non ballroom people believe. Life imitates art? We shall see .

I get this question all the time too It's so difficult to explain to someone the difference between the reality of ballroom and the tv version that they see.

 

[Ailuene]

I think it really depends on the person. With people that are unrealistic about it, sure they might go into ballroom and then drop out immediately when they find out to be competitive it's more about technique than showiness. But at least for me, one of my first exposures to ballroom was actually the movie Shall We Dance. And I will say, though I wasn't a huge fan of the story, merely being shown that movie when I was in elementary school always kept ballroom dancing in the back of my mind as something I wanted to learn very, very much. So making it worse? Maybe for the flaky people that start and immediately drop. For me and many others, I think the accessibility itself is good, even if it's not of the best quality.

 

[middy]

Does anyone think ballroom on tv has made it less so-called "feminine" for men to dance? I'm not sure - could be better with all these football players, athletes, actors, and other "manly" men tackling ballroom and showing that it is a challenging activity/sport, but then there's all the elaborate costuming, stones, tanning and such as well.

 

[bia]

I do see some effect of the local dwts fundraiser (here it's in support of the local boys & girls club) on the visibility of the local pros. There's a very enthusiastic couple in the local dance community who got started as "stars" in the fundraiser, and the fact that the event is well attended by the local "high society" every year at least means that people know where to go for ballroom instruction if they're interested. I'd have to ask the studio if they've seen any real effect on their business; I doubt it's huge, but probably some. And I'm sure the event wouldn't ever have started without the tv show.

 

[dlliba10]

I can't remember where I heard it but it's been said that the world of TV ballroom and competitive ballroom are severely divorced. It's great that there's a show on television featuring a 3x World/National Rhythm Champion and a World/National Smooth Champion and many quite high ranking Latin National and World Finalists and Champions, but ask any typical DWTS viewer what any of those words means and they'll have no clue. I think DWTS is also becoming a bit more self-aware in the pros that they choose -- it's about the glitz and the glam and the wow and the eye candy factor. Incoming pros are hot, young, lithe figures with penchants for cool choreography, not titled mainstays of the competitive circuit.

What I do hope (which I know won't happen) is that the general public's interest in DWTS leads to a revival of America's Ballroom Challenge or *anything* that shows what a real ballroom competition is like. It's not just a ten-week popularity contest and progression of what for all intents and purposes are showdances, culminating in a "freestyle" that decides the whole thing. I love DWTS for what it is. But it is no OSB or USDC.

 

[debmc]

I can't remember where I heard it but it's been said that the world of TV ballroom and competitive ballroom are severely divorced. It's great that there's a show on television featuring a 3x World/National Rhythm Champion and a World/National Smooth Champion and many quite high ranking Latin National and World Finalists and Champions, but ask any typical DWTS viewer what any of those words means and they'll have no clue. I think DWTS is also becoming a bit more self-aware in the pros that they choose -- it's about the glitz and the glam and the wow and the eye candy factor. Incoming pros are hot, young, lithe figures with penchants for cool choreography, not titled mainstays of the competitive circuit.

What I do hope (which I know won't happen) is that the general public's interest in DWTS leads to a revival of America's Ballroom Challenge or *anything* that shows what a real ballroom competition is like. It's not just a ten-week popularity contest and progression of what for all intents and purposes are showdances, culminating in a "freestyle" that decides the whole thing. I love DWTS for what it is. But it is no OSB or USDC.

Yes, that would be great to see the top professional competitions televised.

 

[JudeMorrigan]

I would totally sign up for The Ocho if it had them.

 

[DerekWeb]

I think one good thing has been the football type celebs making dancing seem more macho to the general public. The general perception in the US, right or wrong, was that dancing was effeminate. The athletic celebs and the hunk hetero pros may help to dispel this general perception.