How to handle unequal abilities between partners?
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danceronice
Forum Master
Yeah, I saw the world "pull" and it might be that she's turning early as a learned response to AVOID being pulled around. You are signally the initiation of the turn, you're not actually turning her. If you (OP) are literally MAKING her turn, she may be forced to dance defensively because that's both wrong and uncomfortable. (I've learned 'defensive dancing' from social-dancing with leads who are maybe not clear on this, or who are self-taught 'experts' who have never taken a lesson to be told otherwise. Getting pushed and pulled through turns doesn't help the follow and isn't correct.)
cornutt
Forum Master
One of the things that I've had to learn on those swivels is that, although you want to hold a good firm frame, if you clench up in order to do so, you will make your upper torso lock up and then it won't work. There's a certain resonance that has to be achieved in order for those to work. If your upper torso is too rigid, there isn't enough damping and your partner will not be able to perceive the point at which she should reverse direction. I say this with the admission that I know it in theory a lot better than I do it in practice, but when it's working the way it's supposed to, you can feel it.
Leonid Turetsky
Member
It is important to find a partner that has the same DRIVE as you and same GOALS. Because then even if he/she isn't at your level, they will rise to it quickly if they are driven. They will work hard and do whatever is necessary to reach your level (assuming they are hardworking and want to improve)... But if you see after awhile that you are being dragged down sort of speak, then maybe its best to find a new partner.
After hearing your description of the problems, I agree that this is the best bet for you and your partnership. Try to find a teacher who will focus on connection: body weight, Latin tension/compression, turning technique (both doing the turn and leading it), etc. You can't be expected to lead without knowing the connection behind the lead, and she can't learn to follow without experiencing a proper lead.
ajiboyet
Well-Known Member
Why do I think you're a scientist?
JudeMorrigan
Forum Master
Suffice it to say that he could have had pertinent input into the "engineers that dance" thread.
(I know him from off the boards.)
bia
Forum Master
Or as a first step, ask your current teacher to address these issues: "We're having trouble with connection and lead-follow in these particular places. What should each of us be doing to improve our communication here?" And depending on what kind of help you get, see whether a teacher change is necessary or not. But a big plus to stating the question this way is that it's representing the issue as one shared by the partnership; this is always the more likely case, especially in lead-follow issues, and it's also healthier for the partnership to set yourselves up as teammates on the same side confronting a problem, rather than opposed to each other ("Why is she so stubborn/incompetent that she won't follow my lead?").
ajiboyet
Well-Known Member
Suffice it to say that he could have had pertinent input into the "engineers that dance" thread.
I think it's the use of the words "resonance" and "damping". I studied a little physics myself sometime ago.
Okay, end of hijack.
You can see other teachers without actually changing teachers. Most of the dancers I know have one or two main coaches, but will take one-off lessons with other coaches for new perspective. Personally, I don't think you can get a perfect dance education by seeing only one instructor - they will always have their own blind spots, priorities, methods, etc. The process of meshing the information you get from multiple coaches can help you become more active in the learning process, too.
OP, don't feel tied down to one instructor.
Mr 4 styles
Forum Master
men DO NOT learn faster than women!!! ask my wife!
toothlesstiger
Well-Known Member
"The meaning of your communication is the response you get." This is so very true of leading.
Get another instructor to watch you two dance, and lead an instructor through the figures. Sometimes, what you think you are leading is not what the follower feels you leading.
Get another instructor to watch you two dance, and lead an instructor through the figures. Sometimes, what you think you are leading is not what the follower feels you leading.
llamasarefuzzy
Forum Master
TRUTH. So often, what I feel like I'm doing is about 10 orders of magnitude off of what I'm actually doing, be it hips in latin, shaping in standard, etc. In many cases, what we feel is not what we look like/ feel like to somebody else
madmaximus
Forum Master
These are 4 literal quotes/corrections from 4 different teachers--who were attempting to correct the same error of 1 individual (can you guess what the error was?)
just a thought
m
- "Keep your weight forward when you're stepping back...nose over your toes..."
- "Face your partner when you're turning"
- "Point your right foot to LOD on 2, and rotate your hip 3/8 as your vertical axis traverses the fall line"
- "Feel like your frame and hold are firm but relaxed when you're turning"
- People see (and explain) different parts of the same thing--and will argue that their's is the better perspective.
- Often, it is easier to point out other's mistakes than to see the magnitude of our own (and just as hard to work on ours)
- It takes the right explanation (one that matches the individual's learning model), in order for that individual to realize (and more importantly, FIX) what needs to be corrected.
- Lastly, remember that dance IS A DIFFICULT endeavor--at least for us mere mortals.
just a thought
m
