Man's head position in Viennese Waltz

[Partner Dancer]

A diatribe is a bitter, forceful verbal attack on another.

I am not sure why you would feel that VIT would merit one, for a simple & reasonable statement for clarification.

Looked it up prior to using...

Definition of DIATRIBE
1 archaic : a prolonged discourse
2 : a bitter and abusive speech or piece of writing
3 : ironic or satirical criticism

Shooting for usage #1.

 

[Partner Dancer]

Can we get back on topic please. Head positions.


If you want to start a new thread with revelations and assertions of tangents and coordinates then by all means do so.

It's all related.

One can't use the head effectively if one isn't clear on where one is
headed. (pun intended) A lot of dancers get dizzy or exhausted
in VW because their head position/usage is not consistent with
the travel and rotation they are doing or need to do.

 

[vit]

I suppose main problem with getting dizzy, at least at beginner level, is not connected with usage of the head, but because people are dancing VW trying to rotate around the partner, and it's not what this dance is about. A feeling of moving sideways along LOD during the dance should be dominant (at least I was taught that way). Assisting balance with the head is much more advanced stuff

 

[Piggles]

Dizzy is a neurolgical response to a stimulated sensory hair cells in the ultricle. When these hairs are triggered and move they send a signal to the brain that says "we are moving". WHen they move in unexpected ways they send a "distress signal" to the brain that says "UH-Oh.. We don't know which way the body is going...Sit Down....SIT DOWN NOW" The "sit down" command is interpreted by the brain as "dizzy".

After repeating the offending movements continually over time your brian learns to ignore the "distress signal".
.

Neat-o! I didn't know that. I always wondered why some people got dizzy when spotting and others did not. I'd heard different pro's present various reasons, but Larinda's definately makes the most sense.

 

[Warren J. Dew]

There are other shapes that she make (stretches ia perhaps a better word) throughout the reverse and the naturals that help keep the swing and momentum heading in the correct direction... and when done well they produce the look of no movement... but there are lots of movements and shapes and stretches that are going on. Without them the partnership would appear flat and the top would look small. Even if we can't see Lorraine doing them... she is. And that is the beauty, she is doing them but we don't notice.

I would agree with that. None of those stretches amount to looking to the right on naturals, though.

This is why ballet dancers insist that spotting will cure dizziness. It will be because they repeated it enough times to trick their brains out of freaking out, but not because their head is in some special place at a special time. I learned to not get dizzy because I have shaped my head into turns for the past 20 years. Spotting makes me dizzy because my brain is not accustomed to it as much and the "distress signal" gets through to my brain.

It has nothing to do with putting your head in the right place. It has everything to do with learning to accept the feeling and turn off the response to the distress signal.

I agree it doesn't have to do with head position per se. I don't think it's just a matter of getting used to it, though. As one learns to dance ballroom better, one learns to dance more smoothly, and the more smoothly one dances, the less the otoliths move around, and the less chance they have to cause dizziness.

I wouldn't be surprised if the subtle shaping you mention helps in this respect by making the movement smoother.

 

[Partner Dancer]

Dizzy is a neurolgical response to a stimulated sensory hair cells in the ultricle. When these hairs are triggered and move they send a signal to the brain that says "we are moving". WHen they move in unexpected ways they send a "distress signal" to the brain that says "UH-Oh.. We don't know which way the body is going...Sit Down....SIT DOWN NOW" The "sit down" command is interpreted by the brain as "dizzy".

After repeating the offending movements continually over time your brian learns to ignore the "distress signal".

The practice/training one does is much more for developing the
neurological/muscular/joint/etc. controls of the body to
maintain (sense of, and physical reality of) balance throughout
the maneuvers than for ignoring distress. The dancer in control
simply has less or no distress to ignore. That's why good
dancers are "relaxed" rather than "uptight."

I would even say that at some point, for the "same" movements,
the body gets rewired enough to not only stop generating
distress (chemical/electrical) signals, but to generate exhilaration/
pleasure signals. One can get a "high" from movement/spins, and
hence the expression "joy of movement."

It has nothing to do with putting your head in the right place. It has everything to do with learning to accept the feeling and turn off the response to the distress signal.

Head position is directly related to freeing up momentum to rotate and swing. It is not about dizziness.

Just ask a gymnast practicing tumbles on a balance beam to
start training with the head tilted to one side, ear touching
shoulder. Does anyone really believe head position doesn't
matter?

 

[Partner Dancer]

A lot of dancers get dizzy or exhausted
in VW because their head position/usage is not consistent with
the travel and rotation they are doing or need to do.

Note that this statement by no means states that head position
is the _only_ reason for dizziness/exhaustion. A much bigger and
more general reason for dizziness/exhaustion is simply that many
dancers don't devote enough time and effort (and money) to
figuring out what needs to be done.