"milonguero" website

[dchester]

Forgetting about the tangent of milonguero style, and more about the website in general, now that I've had a chance to look at it: It seems that it's target audience is people who already know who he is, as it doesn't say anything about where he is located, but it does have a page for people to request privates.

While the pages look nice, the content does appear to be a bit disjointed. The page titled, "Music to put you in the tango mood" starts off with two milongas.



Then he has a couple videos, with the second once not even being close to milonguero style (also they both were very nice performances).

There's also a page about alternative music. I played the first clip, and it didn't sound like anything that would inspire me to tango (although maybe the clip wasn't long enough).

Of course he has a page about Milonguero style, but then his "About" page seems to say the site is about all styles.

I don't know what to make of the web site, but it doesn't appear to have a consistent theme across pages.

 

[UKDancer]

My eye was drawn to the Recommended Reading, which turns out to be links to two eBooks for Kindle:

• Embracing Tango
• New Glossary of Tango Dance

Both by Gustavo Benzecry Saba, whose name is not known to me. Does anyone have any knowledge or comments about these texts? They are relatively inexpensive, and the little of the content that is available to view looks interesting ...

 

[ant]

Both by Gustavo Benzecry Saba, whose name is not known to me. Does anyone have any knowledge or comments about these texts? They are relatively inexpensive, and the little of the content that is available to view looks interesting ...

Gustavo teaches with Olivera. They come regularly (about one a year) to the UK where they teach at Tango Feast. I enjoyed classes I have had with them.
They are based in BsAs where they have a regular class. Although they do tour a lot.If I remember correctly they have been mentioned on DF as teachers people considered of a good standard in the past.

 

[Zoopsia59]

My eye was drawn to the Recommended Reading, which turns out to be links to two eBooks for Kindle:

• Embracing Tango
• New Glossary of Tango Dance

Both by Gustavo Benzecry Saba, whose name is not known to me. Does anyone have any knowledge or comments about these texts? They are relatively inexpensive, and the little of the content that is available to view looks interesting ...

Gustavo and Maria are very well regarded here.

 

[dchester]

My eye was drawn to the Recommended Reading, which turns out to be links to two eBooks for Kindle:

• Embracing Tango
• New Glossary of Tango Dance

Both by Gustavo Benzecry Saba, whose name is not known to me. Does anyone have any knowledge or comments about these texts? They are relatively inexpensive, and the little of the content that is available to view looks interesting ...

They (Gustavo Benzecry Saba & Maria Olivera) are outstanding teachers, IMO (very nice people, too). I have (and like) Embracing Tango, although it's not a very long book. Gustavo and Maria were teaching at Salon Canning, when I was in BsAs.

 

[opendoor]

milonguero.org ..The orchestras that are popular when dancing in the Milonguero style are: Carlos Di Sarli, Anibal Troilo, Juan D’Arienzo and Miguel Calo. The style is also known as: Tango Apilado, Tango Club or Tango Confiteria.

I dont follow this. First: the mentioned orchestras also played tango de salón or fantasia, wether parallel or at a certain period.

Second. I find that there is a difference between confiteria and club style.

 

[jantango]

A person can use almost any name they want for a blog or website. That doesn't mean they are writing from first-hand knowledge or with authority on the subject. milonguero.org seems to fall into that category. His video examples prove that fact. Why does someone who includes links become an expert on the subject? This is a marketing tool for classes.

Gustavo and Maria have found their marketing niche. They know that there are many step collectors in the world, and they have an infinite supply to share in their classes. Their latest advertisement in Diostango lists their classes as milonga traspie and double traspie at La Nacional and musicality at Milonguita. They no longer are on the schedule at Salon Canning.

 

[opendoor]

Too bad

..find that there is a difference between confiteria and club style.

Though there should be some milonguero followers around, no one did answer my question - too bad

 

[Zoopsia59]

Though there should be some milonguero followers around, no one did answer my question - too bad

I don't think anyone realized there was a question to followers in your post. It seems more like a statement rather than a question.

I don't know what the difference between club and confiteria would be because no one around here uses the term confiteria. And club style would vary by club wouldn't it? Isn't that sorta where a lot of these style distinctions come from? The different styles from different clubs or barrios?

 

[opendoor]

Thanks Zoops !

So in other words,

-what were the differences concerning dancing in cafés, confiterias, and crowded gyms (clubs)? I found an interview with Tete, but there are contradictory statements in it http://teteysilvia.blogspot.com/2010/12/entrevista-con-tete.html

 

[JohnEm]

A question of style

Though there should be some milonguero followers around, no one did answer my question - too bad

So in other words, what are the differences between tango danced in small cafés (confiteria style), and tango danced in crowded gyms (club style)? What has been the specific music style in either type of venue?

Milongueros/as would tell you there is no such distinction and
no such styles - it's all Salon. It's modern marketing following
the revival of tango that has resulted in the many names.

May be Susana Miller started it by inventing milonguero as a style,
maybe someone else did earlier but it's all irrelevant. Tango should
be your own: the only overriding criteria are

1. It appeals to your partner (it's comfortable)
2. Your dance is of the music (fits comfortably with the music)
3. You dance in sympathetic awareness of other dancers
(coexist comfortably with others whatever the conditions)

It's the requirement of No.3 that changes the leader's dance
and some dance completely differently according to the conditions.

There's video of Ricardo Vidort which clearly indicates that he danced
according to the conditions. The situation of the space is unimportant
(club or confiteria) it's the situation within the space that is influential
and you have described both as crowded.

Asking a genuine milonguera follower would also be a waste of time,
as they dance with their chosen men in whatever way those men choose.
Ask many a good follower in BsAs, porteño or foreign, and most have little
or even no interest in styles, names etc. Their common aim is to be able
to dance with any man no matter what his "style".

Only teachers seem to care about such matters and you already know
the reason for that. I'm more interested to know why it is that you think
it's so important and why you think you need to know!

As an aside: you describe Confiterias as small but Confiteria Ideal
is actually larger than Lo de Celia and some other spaces. Other than
milongas at Ideal, as far as I can ascertain there are now no other
confiterias advertising public dancing. Ideal itself is in a state of sad decay
and barely functions as a Confiteria in anything but name.

There is a beautiful space in the the rather grand and very period cafe
at Retiro rail station but they only seem to advertise tango shows.

Finally there are plenty of resources on the web with a variety of answers:

http://www.danceweb.co.uk/library/p...ero.22_.28tango_apilado.2Fconfiteria_style.29

http://tangovoice.wordpress.com/category/tango-estilo-del-centro/

 

[Steve Pastor]

Sort of following up on Zoopsia's reply to this

no one did answer my question

...
Maybe it's just me and being somewhat literal minded, but I will often look to see if there are any question marks in a post. If there aren't, I'm less likely to repsond.
I admit, though, that I am nothing if not old school!

 

[Zoopsia59]

Milongueros/as would tell you there is no such distinction and
no such styles - it's all Salon. It's modern marketing following
the revival of tango that has resulted in the many names.

May be Susana Miller started it by inventing milonguero as a style,

Asking a genuine milonguera follower would also be a waste of time,

Only teachers seem to care about such matters and you already know
the reason for that.

While I agree with you in theory about the attitude towards tango in BA and the way different milongueros created their own uniqueness (that being part of the definition of a milonguero, after all!) the bottom line is that tango can be danced quite a few different ways. To be able to talk about those ways, it's handy to have names for at least the most distinct variations.

If you think about it, people's names are fairly arbitrary too and tell you little or nothing about the person. Maybe someone with the last name Jackson had an ancestor at some point who was the son of Jack, but as for any useful info about the Jackson you are talking about right now? Probably not.

However, if you had to refer to this Jackson guy as "the guy who is average height & build, male pattern baldness, usually wears a cap and jeans", not only would it take a lot more effort to get your listener to know who you are referring to, but the description might be too generic (as in my example) to get you very far. After all, isn't it easier for the police to identify a suspect when someone actually knows the suspect's NAME instead of just giving a description?

So I think it's important to have some names for tango styles. This forum is a good example... while we may not agree on every detail of what defines nuevo or milonguero, at least using those names gives a starting point for the overall technique and look that someone is mostly likely discussing.

Yes, teachers use these distinctions sometimes just as marketing gimmicks, but think how much worse things might be if they didn't! Someone offers a "tango" workshop (no style distinction) and someone who really wants to focus on more traditional dancing because that's what there is room for in their chosen milonga goes, only to discover that it is all open embrace, high boleos, and leg wraps done standing in place.

Or someone teaches "tango" and focuses on a particular style, never even mentioning that it is a style and that there are other styles the student might encounter, leading the student to believe that anything else is simply incorrect.

The better dancers DO develop their own "style", but usually within the confines a a broader stylistic base. The different "traditional" leaders here each feel different to me as a follower and they are not clones. However, they are still more like one another than any is like the leaders who dance only open embrace nuevo to alternative music.

And, just to be a brat.. I'm going to ask you this:

If there really is no such distinction and Susanna Miller "invented" milonguero.. what is a "genuine milonguera follower" ?

 

[AndaBien]

...So I think it's important to have some names for tango styles. This forum is a good example... while we may not agree on every detail of what defines nuevo or milonguero, at least using those names gives a starting point for the overall technique and look that someone is mostly likely discussing...

My prof in Bio-101 was teaching us the characteristics of each phylum. Later in the semester he told us that a certain species was no longer considered to be an X, buy was now thought to be a Y. The moral of the story, he said, was that, "God made the animals, while man made the phyla". We couldn't talk about animals if we didn't have names for them. And so it goes.

(Did you know that mushrooms are neither plant, nor animal, nor mineral)?

 

[Zoopsia59]

(Did you know that mushrooms are neither plant, nor animal, nor mineral)?

Does that mean fungus isn't considered "plant"? I guess that makes sense. Come to think of it... there are probably other things that don't fall into one of those 3 categories.