My Tango sucks.

[Gssh]

Bordertangoman: Uuuh, i am really not that good a tango dancer - i have danced for a while, but i am only barely an intermediate dancer. What i feel strongly about is that most of this stuff is not as difficult to work on as it appears when people try to show it. Like trying "triple time": I can't do triple time reliably - but if there is some fast flourish on the piano and have managed a double time or two with the same follower before i try, and , sometimes it is just double time becuase that all the follower agrees to, sometimes its 2.7 time, sometimes 3.4 time, and i have slur the next step a bit to get on time again, but a few rare times we nailed it, and it was great. If not - well, it was still fun, and it accentuated the music in a sloppy way, and nobody got hurt. Most followers seem to take this kind of error in stride, and sometimes when i try variations of walking I can feel how they switch from dancing automatically to really "listening" - and thats a wonderful moment in itself.
Compared to doing this working on for example a backward sacada is painful: if it doesn't work i either stepped on her, or i have aborted the move while we both are in awfully contorted positions - thats not fun for either of us. And i can't really hide practicing this in my normal dance, because it fails way to spectacularily when it fails.

Ampster: Re: Arnis: Have you read the "Manual al Baratero"? Sometimes it seems to me that FMA and Tango have some common ancestors .

Gssh

 

[Steve Pastor]

It may be good fortune that my answer to "why not go to milongas after a few lessons?" evaporated yesterday.
Let's just say that the act of learning a new, very difficult skill can be both very frustrating and, at the same time, very rewarding.
I was not very comfortable with taking it out after only a few lessons and relying on the kindness of strangers. (Exhibit #1 is Blanche DuBois.)
I took lessons for six months before I went to my first practica. Practicas are not purgatory. They are a place to work on your dance. Some hold to the belief that you should know how to dance before going to a milonga. When you consider that dancing only one dance with someone is considered a slight, so to be polite you are expected to dance an entire tanda..... In my opinion you are being considerate of the other dancers by not expecting them to accomodate you.
Sometimes the journey can be at least as rewarding as arriving at the destination. Come to think of it, sometimes arriving is followed by a big let down.

 

[bordertangoman]

Re: double time: I got how to do this in a workshop when the teacher showed how the body - specifically the hips - has to stiffen up for the small fast steps and you soften again when you slow down. The reason for this is it makes your leg motion be able to be felt by the follower.

Have you ever seen how racing walkers walk, well its a bit like that.

 

[uncle joe]

I came in third in the Valentino Tango Contest held at the Hollywood Palladium in 1952; the dancers were judged by an applaudo meter. Frank Veloz of Veloz & Yolanda chain studios was the Host of the event.
Up until the 1960's AT did have standard dance patterns the were standard among the US Chain Dance Studios.
After leaving the Dance scene for some forty years I was confused with the way AT tango evolved in this country to i's present form.
Although I){ am completely fascinated with the revolved AT, I) still feel there is a great lose if we let the olds style of AT die.
Fortunately there is a move, 'The Lou Gearig Story' where Frank and Yolanda do the old style of AT.
Recently I taught a couple a routine using the old AT patterns. It was filmed and I intend to have the film converted to a DVD and copied onto my website.
Again, I believe the evolved AT is a dance unique from the old style AT of the 1930's to the 60's and much more intricate and seductive. I wish I could dance this style, but unfortunately I lost my equilibrium in an accident so all I can do is enjoy watching it... but the Old AT should be revived, and I'd give free lessons if someone sets up a venue in Old Pasadena.

 

[hbboogie1]

Please help!
Over the last two years I’ve learned some basics in about 15 dances. Argentine tango remains my most troublesome. And least enjoyable.

I took a 6-7 lessons a year ago, tryed a milonga or two , felt nothing and quit. Happy to just do a basic tango walk when a tango comes on at the socials.
Now I’m making another foray into AT. Bought an expensive AT DVD, took a few more lessons and still s**k at it!
Last night at a milonga I was often thanked at the end of the first song in the tanda. Why can’t I enjoy this dance the way you can with just a few swing lessons or cha cha or hustle. The pleasure of this dance still eludes me.

Can someone please advise me. I’m thinking of quiting this dance again. My main complaints are:

1. Followers instruct me
2. Followers get frustrated
3. Followers start doing things that I am not leading
4. I feel like I’m just walking around the floor all worried and not feeling any passion
5. I don’t feel the pleasure of dancing this.

**Can someone give me advise on how to enjoy this dance at least uitil I can **get better.

Maybe I should just focus on a simple walk? Is there a mind set to have to feel some passion when doing AT?

Thanks

bordertangoman quote I knew a teacher who used the dreaded 8CB to hook people; by learning 8 steps in a sequence they thought they were dancing and with a few variations they had the impression of progress, so they were happy and kept coming. In fact it was taking them longer to learn how to dance tango since they weren't being taught the necessary skills of leading and following, which I guess might be boring to a beginner


The dreaded 8CB can be taught in a matter of minutes and most so called intermediate or advanced tango dancers could probably demonstrate it for you. Now lets talk about actually dancing the 8CB. In my vast experience I have only run across a few people that can dance it properly. It would take a true intermediate or advanced dancer a long long long time to learn how to execute the eight count basic properly. What most don’t understand is that every step in the basic has a distinctive lead and follow it’s a very difficult sequence to learn and to lead. So if this teacher is actually teaching the basic properly and you spend many months mastering it you will be a better leader then most of the Men who believe in the kung fu Zen method of learning tango. The secret of dancing tango well is practice not five minutes a day but hours a day for years. It sounds to me like you don’t want to invest any time to learn tango. It will take you a year to begin to feel comfortable on the social dance floor so make a commitment and after a year if you still feel like you’re not progressing then quit.
Good luck

 

[opendoor]

Your defensive forces are still to strong

Hi aaah,
you have received such a lot of helpful answers, so I dont know, if my severe advice is still important, yet.

Over the last two years I’ve learned some basics in about 15 dances ..

I believe that you learn a special dance more in an academic manner rather than from the feeling and the atmosphere.
But in TA it works the other way round! It is possible to dance TA without any knowledge of steps. And f.i. , standing is a very important part of TA, as well. Start only by inhaling the atmosphere, and make only a few steps.

My main complaints are:

1. Followers instruct me
   ...
2. Followers start doing things that I am not leading

Congratulations, these are good tokens?/signs? (sorry my english). Followers are the best teachers. Be happy to communicate with them. Ask for details. And, the most important hint, build up a social network !

If you cannot enjoy only to hear the music, to do a few steps, to hold a woman tight, to sway gently on the spot, the feeling of success will never come. Let you get yourself overwhelmed. Nothing else really works. TA is an infectious disease, we all here are infected to the bone. Your defensive forces are still to strong.

OD

 

[Gssh]

The more things change, the more they stay the same. *sigh*. This is the first thread i ever replied to. Makes me a bit nostalgic.

I am always startled when old threads get revived like that - so little change. I just read what i wrote 3 years ago, and i would pretty much write the same things again. And so would Ampster, and Bordertangoman, and all the other usual suspects.

Tango is sometimes a hard, long journey - i am pretty sure/quite hopeful that i have made some progress since then, but looking at how little my view of the dance has changed i start to doubt.

Gssh

 

[bastet]

The more things change, the more they stay the same. *sigh*. This is the first thread i ever replied to. Makes me a bit nostalgic.

I am always startled when old threads get revived like that - so little change. I just read what i wrote 3 years ago, and i would pretty much write the same things again. And so would Ampster, and Bordertangoman, and all the other usual suspects.

Tango is sometimes a hard, long journey - i am pretty sure/quite hopeful that i have made some progress since then, but looking at how little my view of the dance has changed i start to doubt.

Gssh

I thought your posts were eloquent and true to form. And I was surprised to see the original post date on them as it could have been yesterday that the thread started and the answers would have been much the same so I've made absolutely no attempt to comment on the OP itself due to the age of it. I only hope they found what they needed.

I'm sure you've made personal progress, that may not change what you find important in the dance. There's no reason why you can't make personal progress and still have the same values you did before in what you find important in the dance.

 

[bordertangoman]

The more things change, the more they stay the same. *sigh*. This is the first thread i ever replied to. Makes me a bit nostalgic.

I am always startled when old threads get revived like that - so little change. I just read what i wrote 3 years ago, and i would pretty much write the same things again. And so would Ampster, and Bordertangoman, and all the other usual suspects.



Gssh

well we're just boring old farts

 

[opendoor]

well we're just boring old farts

.. and I am a Zombie ! The post I responded is out dated

 

[tangomaniac]

If you're only being taught patterns, you'll never learn how to dance tango well. You need to concentrate on technique. My teacher used to say it's the HOW, not the WHAT that's important. Here's an example. On a tile or hard wood floor, stand in front of a chair that has coasters. Practice moving the chair shifting your weight, not moving your foot. Stand on one foot, and lead the chair to move backwards with your weight. After the chair moves, step. If you step into the chair, it means you moved your foot before you moved the chair.

Michael

 

[Consuela]

Up until the 1960's AT did have standard dance patterns the were standard among the US Chain Dance Studios.
After leaving the Dance scene for some forty years I was confused with the way AT tango evolved in this country to i's present form.
Although I){ am completely fascinated with the revolved AT, I) still feel there is a great lose if we let the olds style of AT die.

Again, I believe the evolved AT is a dance unique from the old style AT of the 1930's to the 60's and much more intricate and seductive. I wish I could dance this style, but unfortunately I lost my equilibrium in an accident so all I can do is enjoy watching it... but the Old AT should be revived, and I'd give free lessons if someone sets up a venue in Old Pasadena.

This is an interesting perspective. I'm not from the US and haven't yet had the opportunity to dance there, so am not familiar with how Americans generally dance AT. It sounds to me like the 'evolved' style Uncle Joe talks about is actually closer the 'old' style of AT (up to 1955); ie improvised, intricate, with the focus on the connection between leader and follower as opposed to performing standard patterns (which sounds like ballroom tango to me).

 

[Steve Pastor]

First off, sorry to hear about your equilibrium problem, Joe.

From what I've seen of "textbooks" on dance, tango, often with adjective "Argentine" in front of it, was taught as any other ballroom dance. One quailfier, though, is that some of these texts addressed lead / follow rather extensively, but not more so for tango than the other dances. And, there were no specific directions for each named sequence of steps.

Joe writes

Up until the 1960's AT did have standard dance patterns the were standard among the US Chain Dance Studios.

, and this agrees with what I've seen in books from as early as the 1910s through the 70s.

I believe the evolved AT is a dance unique from the old style AT of the 1930's to the 60's and much more intricate and seductive.

And, I also agree with this.

 

[spectator]

The guys all give good and carefully considered advice. My thought is that if it is a quick fix you are after, maybe you should give the milongas a miss for a few weeks and arrange some private lessons/approach a friendly more experienced lady and ask for some intensive and brutally honest practice sessions. If you go down that route be prepared for a roasting but accept it for what it is-short term pain for long term gain.

 

[Ampster]

The more things change, the more they stay the same. *sigh*. This is the first thread i ever replied to. Makes me a bit nostalgic.

I am always startled when old threads get revived like that - so little change. I just read what i wrote 3 years ago, and i would pretty much write the same things again. And so would Ampster, and Bordertangoman, and all the other usual suspects.

Tango is sometimes a hard, long journey - i am pretty sure/quite hopeful that i have made some progress since then, but looking at how little my view of the dance has changed i start to doubt.

Gssh

Eh... What!? :shock: I didn't do it, I swear! :nope: :banana:

btw, spectator: Where have you been?