Questions from a sweaty beginner

Hello and thank you again to everyone who replied. Many excellent tips for which I am grateful.
I wanted to clarify that (of course! ) I take a shower before the class. I don't smell and , oddly, it is not my armpits that perspire, but my back. So, I am always overly conscious about a man having to touch my back and (perhaps) feeling icky. I usually change if there is a practica after the class, but can't quite run away and change in a midst of it. I suppose no open-back dresses or tops for me, ever...oh, well....

And ask other about sweating. We are not so used to sweating in everyday activities. You might be too sensitive about it.
If you really sweat too much you can either change more frequently or chose some fast drying material that also have natural feel (not plastic)
 
Hello to all!
Thrilled to have found your website (I already anticipate spending hours on it...ahhh..)

I just started learning (about a month ago or so).
My questions:

1. I had no idea I was such a sweaty woman, darn it! No, really. By the time we are in the middle of the class, my back is "conveniently" covered in perspiration. I wear a t-shirt under a shirt, but, still, by the end of the class my top shirt is slightly moist. I am ridiculously self-conscious of this and can't imagine what to do if I have to go to a milonga!!! I can't imagine I am the only one with this issue. How do you, ladies, solve this? Tips and tricks are very much appreciated!

I sweat a lot, too. A lot. I often apologize for it when I take the embrace, but the men never seem to mind because they're usually sweaty, too. In fact, I'd venture to say that some of them actually like it.

2. Currently, I take 4 classes a week. Every teacher has a very different personality and I very much enjoy the classes. Is this "too much"? I don't want to burn out, but even as I am sitting at work now, I am already pouting for not having a class tonight.
I just don't want to experience a newbie burnout, if such thing exists.

Keep taking them as long as you can/want. When you need a break, take one, but I bet that will be a long while.

4. One of my teachers wants me to go to a milonga in March. I am kind of terrified (to say the least) of attending since I really have no clue yet. However, I do not wish to aggravate my teacher who feels that I am ready (or so he says). Should I attend? Should I wait until I have had at least 3 months under my belt? Will there be a quiet corner to hide in? :)

Don't go in March. Go this weekend. Ok, go this weekend AND in March. No one expects you to be perfect. If you're taking that many classes and you've done some practicas, you should be able to dance at a milonga. What exactly are you scared of?

5. I constantly am being asked by leaders (who are also newbies like myself) if they have led something properly. I don't know what to say to them! Their lead is much different from the teacher's and, at times, I feel is incorrect, but who am I to say?
What is the proper response?

Make sure you're doing exactly what you feel the lead telling you to do--be an "honest" follower and don't try to help by doing what you think they want. My response is always to shrug and say, "Did I do what you wanted? Then I guess it was fine." Of course it doesn't feel like the teacher and many leaders will never feel like a teacher. If it isn't working, I would refer them to the teacher rather than try to help them.

7. What other exercises (not dance) do you believe helped you in becoming a better dancer?

You want to improve balance, control, strength, and cardiovascular fitness, and there are lots of ways to do that. Zumba, yoga, pilates, running. Do releves (slowly going up on your toes) to strengthen your feet. Learn to engage your core muscles.

Welcome to Tango! I have one more piece of advice you didn't ask about: don't worry about learning all the embellishments and adornos and what-not in order to look "fancy." Concentrate on learning to be a really good follower. Relax in the man's arms and let him take care of you. Wait for him. This is far more important that what you wear. :)
 
Hello and thank you again to everyone who replied. Many excellent tips for which I am grateful.
I wanted to clarify that (of course! ) I take a shower before the class. I don't smell and , oddly, it is not my armpits that perspire, but my back. So, I am always overly conscious about a man having to touch my back and (perhaps) feeling icky. I usually change if there is a practica after the class, but can't quite run away and change in a midst of it. I suppose no open-back dresses or tops for me, ever...oh, well....

I'm actually thinking the opposite... if you you wear an open back then that area would be exposed and therefore be cooler than if you covered it. Also having your back exposed would help it dry faster.
 
Twnkltz, you asked what I am afraid of (and thank you for your reply, btw!! ). Well, I am scared that I will be such a ______(terrible, unruly, unknowledgeable, boring, , sweaty, etc) follower that Noone will dance with me again! Ever! LOL
(and I am only half kidding!)
 
Twnkltz, you asked what I am afraid of (and thank you for your reply, btw!! ). Well, I am scared that I will be such a ______(terrible, unruly, unknowledgeable, boring, , sweaty, etc) follower that Noone will dance with me again! Ever! LOL
(and I am only half kidding!)

I bet you're not. So there. Go to the milonga.
 
1. I had no idea I was such a sweaty woman, darn it! No, really. By the time we are in the middle of the class, my back is "conveniently" covered in perspiration. I wear a t-shirt under a shirt, but, still, by the end of the class my top shirt is slightly moist. I am ridiculously self-conscious of this and can't imagine what to do if I have to go to a milonga!!! I can't imagine I am the only one with this issue. How do you, ladies, solve this? Tips and tricks are very much appreciated!
Hi there! I'm sorry it took me so long to respond (this is a topic near and dear to my heart, lol), but it's been a very hectic week at work.

No, you are not the only one to deal with this issue. The saying is that "men sweat, ladies perspire." No. Hell no. I freakin' sweat like a damn pig. It sucks, I know. When I had short hair, there were multiple times when I'd have sweat literally dripping off the ends of my hair 15 minutes into a lesson. While I'm not exactly thin now (5'4", 150), I was much thinner when I started dancing...it didn't make a difference, so I doubt it has to do with size or athleticism. It isn't just lesson- or dance-related; any time I have to interact with people (which is, you know...always), I get nervous and sweat. I plan what I wear around what meetings I have during the day; even though I've known most of my coworkers for 14 years, I still get nervous and sweat through my clothing when I have even a social conversation with them. I've had notes, stuck in my back pocket, end up illegible because I sweat so much that I sweat through my jeans and the ink ran. It sucks. Hard. I really, really get it.

You're not the only one. Take a shower and wear clean clothes and deoderant, so your sweat isn't stinky. Bring a towel to mop yourself off. Wear clothes that don't show sweat. Wear clothes that you are comfortable in, that will help keep you cool. Pants+cami+shrug is good, because it will leave your lower back, chest, and neck bare or with only a thin layer, but will keep sweat off direct contact with a leader's skin. Other than that...there isn't much you can do.

If you sweat more when you're nervous (like me), then trust that that will end eventually.


2. Currently, I take 4 classes a week. Every teacher has a very different personality and I very much enjoy the classes. Is this "too much"? I don't want to burn out, but even as I am sitting at work now, I am already pouting for not having a class tonight.
I just don't want to experience a newbie burnout, if such thing exists.
Think of it this way: you WILL burn out. Accept it, accept it as part of the learning/growing process, and move on. Enjoy what you've got now. If four lessons a week is working for you, let it work and enjoy it. When it stops being enjoyable (or when you start getting conflicting information that's holding you back instead of helping you forward), then stop. But don't stop what you enjoy now because of the fear of some possibility in the future.


3. I have salsa shoes, but my feet hurt from being stepped on. Where can I buy (online) tango shoes with closed toe and a 2.5 inch heel or so?
I don't know about online vendors, but I'd suggest putting more thought into technique. You shouldn't be getting stepped on that regularly. Most of the damage that was ever done to my feet I managed to do to myself (because I am just _that_ talented!).

4. One of my teachers wants me to go to a milonga in March. I am kind of terrified (to say the least) of attending since I really have no clue yet. However, I do not wish to aggravate my teacher who feels that I am ready (or so he says). Should I attend? Should I wait until I have had at least 3 months under my belt? Will there be a quiet corner to hide in? :)
As an introvert, who is painfully shy, who has spent a lifetime cultivating the art of being a wallflower, who can disappear from a room or a one-on-one conversation quite effectively...I say go. Don't let your fears make it out to be more scary than it is. There is _always_ a quiet, dark corner to hide in. But even so...the more you build it up in your mind, the scarier it will become. It can become paralyzing; don't let that happen. Go, and adjust your expectations. Go, and think about just going and seeing what it's like. If I can go to milongas, by myself (and even after six (?) years, I still get almost sick to my stomach before walking in), then so can you. Who cares about three months? What's so magical about three months anyhow? Go. Enjoy yourself. Warn leaders that you are a beginner when (WHEN!) they ask you, but don't apologize for that. Everyone starts somewhere. Just go. Don't build it up in your mind to be more than it is.


5. I constantly am being asked by leaders (who are also newbies like myself) if they have led something properly. I don't know what to say to them! Their lead is much different from the teacher's and, at times, I feel is incorrect, but who am I to say?
What is the proper response?
"None of us is bleeding. None of us fell on the floor. I'm having a good time. It must have been good enough!" Seriously. I've bled, I've fallen, I've not had a good time. And so what? It's just dancing. Say you're a beginner so you don't know well enough to tell. They should know better than to ask at a milonga anyhow! ;-)


6. Are there any websites or youtube videos that have exercises for solo practice?
No clue.

7. What other exercises (not dance) do you believe helped you in becoming a better dancer?
I smoke. When I'm standing outside smoking, particularly when I'm in heels, I practice crossing one foot over the other smoothly. Forwards and backwards. My teacher noticed. I do molinetes around my cats' food dish when I'm waiting for something in the kitchen. I don't exercise...pretty sure I'm allergic. (Which is why I weigh as much as I do. So sue me! ;))

More seriously...any cardio is good. Pilates is good for being aware of your posture and your core. Wearing heels lots and learning your balance in them, and strengthening your ankles is good. Releves are good.


8. Where can I buy a skirt to wear with tights? I see my teacher wearing one, but was a bit intimidated to ask her. However, I think it would be a more convenient option than jeans (taking into consideration my "perspiration" issue).
I always wore jeans, or jean shorts for lessons. Some people find that offensive...that's nice. My lessons, don't care. For milongas...not so much. I'm not much of a skirt kinda girl. Why be intimidated about asking? "So...this is kind of a strange question, but...I really like your skirt. Where did you buy it?" Done and done. No biggie. (Again, I say this as someone who is intimidated by pretty much everyone. Seriously. When it comes to social anxiety evaluations, I score in the highly socially anxious range. Socially inept. If I can do it, so can you.)



9. So far, I have identified 3 favorites (music-wise). If you could point me to a direction of something that you believe I might like, I would greatly appreciate it!
(Favorites: Silueta Portena, El Jardin del Amor, El Adios).
I don't know those songs offhand. I suck at names--of people, of songs, you name it. I'm personally a fan of compilations. Failing that, take the songs you like...find out who wrote them and/or who performed them...then take those answers and find more recordings of songs written/performed by the same group.


Thank you all in advance!!!!
You're welcome! Welcome to D-F! It's nice to have a new face, of someone new and enthusiastic! (It brings back so many wonderful memories.)
 
Hi there! I'm sorry it took me so long to respond (this is a topic near and dear to my heart, lol), but it's been a very hectic week at work.

No, you are not the only one to deal with this issue. The saying is that "men sweat, ladies perspire." No. Hell no. I freakin' sweat like a damn pig. It sucks, I know. When I had short hair, there were multiple times when I'd have sweat literally dripping off the ends of my hair 15 minutes into a lesson. While I'm not exactly thin now (5'4", 150), I was much thinner when I started dancing...it didn't make a difference, so I doubt it has to do with size or athleticism. It isn't just lesson- or dance-related; any time I have to interact with people (which is, you know...always), I get nervous and sweat. I plan what I wear around what meetings I have during the day; even though I've known most of my coworkers for 14 years, I still get nervous and sweat through my clothing when I have even a social conversation with them. I've had notes, stuck in my back pocket, end up illegible because I sweat so much that I sweat through my jeans and the ink ran. It sucks. Hard. I really, really get it.

You're not the only one. Take a shower and wear clean clothes and deoderant, so your sweat isn't stinky. Bring a towel to mop yourself off. Wear clothes that don't show sweat. Wear clothes that you are comfortable in, that will help keep you cool. Pants+cami+shrug is good, because it will leave your lower back, chest, and neck bare or with only a thin layer, but will keep sweat off direct contact with a leader's skin. Other than that...there isn't much you can do.

If you sweat more when you're nervous (like me), then trust that that will end eventually.


Think of it this way: you WILL burn out. Accept it, accept it as part of the learning/growing process, and move on. Enjoy what you've got now. If four lessons a week is working for you, let it work and enjoy it. When it stops being enjoyable (or when you start getting conflicting information that's holding you back instead of helping you forward), then stop. But don't stop what you enjoy now because of the fear of some possibility in the future.


I don't know about online vendors, but I'd suggest putting more thought into technique. You shouldn't be getting stepped on that regularly. Most of the damage that was ever done to my feet I managed to do to myself (because I am just _that_ talented!).

As an introvert, who is painfully shy, who has spent a lifetime cultivating the art of being a wallflower, who can disappear from a room or a one-on-one conversation quite effectively...I say go. Don't let your fears make it out to be more scary than it is. There is _always_ a quiet, dark corner to hide in. But even so...the more you build it up in your mind, the scarier it will become. It can become paralyzing; don't let that happen. Go, and adjust your expectations. Go, and think about just going and seeing what it's like. If I can go to milongas, by myself (and even after six (?) years, I still get almost sick to my stomach before walking in), then so can you. Who cares about three months? What's so magical about three months anyhow? Go. Enjoy yourself. Warn leaders that you are a beginner when (WHEN!) they ask you, but don't apologize for that. Everyone starts somewhere. Just go. Don't build it up in your mind to be more than it is.


"None of us is bleeding. None of us fell on the floor. I'm having a good time. It must have been good enough!" Seriously. I've bled, I've fallen, I've not had a good time. And so what? It's just dancing. Say you're a beginner so you don't know well enough to tell. They should know better than to ask at a milonga anyhow! ;-)


No clue.

I smoke. When I'm standing outside smoking, particularly when I'm in heels, I practice crossing one foot over the other smoothly. Forwards and backwards. My teacher noticed. I do molinetes around my cats' food dish when I'm waiting for something in the kitchen. I don't exercise...pretty sure I'm allergic. (Which is why I weigh as much as I do. So sue me! ;))

More seriously...any cardio is good. Pilates is good for being aware of your posture and your core. Wearing heels lots and learning your balance in them, and strengthening your ankles is good. Releves are good.


I always wore jeans, or jean shorts for lessons. Some people find that offensive...that's nice. My lessons, don't care. For milongas...not so much. I'm not much of a skirt kinda girl. Why be intimidated about asking? "So...this is kind of a strange question, but...I really like your skirt. Where did you buy it?" Done and done. No biggie. (Again, I say this as someone who is intimidated by pretty much everyone. Seriously. When it comes to social anxiety evaluations, I score in the highly socially anxious range. Socially inept. If I can do it, so can you.)



I don't know those songs offhand. I suck at names--of people, of songs, you name it. I'm personally a fan of compilations. Failing that, take the songs you like...find out who wrote them and/or who performed them...then take those answers and find more recordings of songs written/performed by the same group.


You're welcome! Welcome to D-F! It's nice to have a new face, of someone new and enthusiastic! (It brings back so many wonderful memories.)

Peaches, thank you so much for such a detailed reply!!!

I started bringing extra clothes with me to practice.
Thanks to everyone's encouragement, I decided to challenge myself and went to a free class followed by Milonga this past Friday.
Got to dance only with beginners from my class and a guy I know from practica in another place. Still, I am very glad that I went.

An observation. I was really surprised that :

a) some women (age 45+) who (in my eyes) appeared to dance really well were not invited as often as younger women who (aside from being young and skinny) didn't seem to have much knowledge. I was really blown away by that. I thought of Milongas as a place to come for the pleasure of dancing, not to pick up. Am I missing something?

b) some women I know from a class seem to have changed their demeanor when in Milonga. All of a sudden they appeared ...hmm...how should I put it...guarded of the men they danced with. I can't quite explain it, but they sort of became unfriendly...in a passive aggressive kind of way. I haven't attempted to steal their shoes or their men, so I can't imagine what might have caused it. Maybe I am misreading this, too.
Comments?

c) on another hand, I was THRILLED to find wonderful, warm, friendly women, too. I chatted with a few, and they were encouraging, forthcoming, and just nice to be around. They were mostly in their 50s, so I don't know if there is a correlation between age/attitude, but found it interesting.

Any and all comments are appreciated.
 
An observation. I was really surprised that :

a) some women (age 45+) who (in my eyes) appeared to dance really well were not invited as often as younger women who (aside from being young and skinny) didn't seem to have much knowledge. I was really blown away by that. I thought of Milongas as a place to come for the pleasure of dancing, not to pick up. Am I missing something?
I wasn't at this milonga, so I don't really know what was going on there. However, it is possible that some of the "better" dancers may look really good (graceful, fancy embellishments, etc.), but possibly may not be as good at the embrace aspect of the dance.

This is an over simplification, but one way of categorizing tango dancers is by those who are "into the steps", and the others that are "into the embrace". Often a dancer who is "into the embrace" is simply not a good fit for someone who is "into the steps".

IMO, not everyone gets /experiences this, but when the dancers are both really into the embrace, the steps cease to be important. I've heard it described a lot of ways (tango trance, zen state, etc). Once you really experience it, your approach to tango may change. For me, the type of song is a big factor in this.

Looks may get a women her first dance with a guy, but typically, it won't be enough to keep him coming back. The guy can't see how pretty you are or how graceful you look when he's dancing with you. He only knows how you feel. Basically, if you have a good embrace, wait for the lead, and step on the beat, that's enough for a lot of people, (and you'd be surprised how many aren't really proficient at all three of those). While this certainly isn't the end of where you might want to be, I think it's a good foundation to build from.
 
I chatted with a few, and they were encouraging, forthcoming, and just nice to be around. They were mostly in their 50s, so I don't know if there is a correlation between age/attitude, but found it interesting.

"Older", or as I like to think of them, "more mature," people become less concerned with the "mating" / "hooking up" / competitive aspects of a social dance scene, as a general observation.
 
You just discovered the lament of many a woman at milongas, and there are several discussions here about it. Good dancers who are older/heavier/not as pretty sit while cute young girls in short skirts who are lesser dancers dance. All you can do is try to keep a good attitude about it and learn to be as good a partner as you can so you still get to dance.
 
PinkBlossom, congratulation on attending your first milonga.
I assume since you can take a class almost every day of the week, there is a fairly developed tango community, and a choice of milongas to attend in your area. If it is not the case, read the following as a general info in case you visit such a place in the future.
Not all milongas created equal. Some milongas are more pickup-y. Some have low level of dancing in general, so the partners are picked on different criteria. In some milongas people circulate more, so everyone dances more. In other milongas the group of people go to hand out together, so the newcomer won't get much action dance or social wise. A garden variety milonga outside Buenos Aires will probably have a bit of everything of the above, the difference is in what proportion.
It is the same as with the classes. Firstly, you may do your homework and research, or just go and try different places, and eventually, since there is a choice, it comes the time to become more discerning. You will come back to places where you feel better, milongas the teacher whose opinion you respect the most recommends, where mind liked people go, so you can enjoy your experience more. There will be a favorite milonga(s) , and a milonga (or several) that you never attend.
Now it is important to remember, in the milonga, same as in tango in general

not everything is as it looks/seems.

For example, you see an older women sitting and not dancing much. What is really going on here? Is she passed because of her age? Does her dancing suck? Or simply she does not care to dance with bad (in her book) partners, and those happen to be the majority of the attendees, who, btw, already know she'd turn them down, so they don't approach her. You cannot tell right away, especially when you are new.

You also noticed, that the attitude in the milonga is different from class and practicas. Some people who come to the latter to welcome newcomers and help beginners, do not go to the milonga with the same approach in mind. Hence, in class they may be more inclusive and helpful, and more selfish and concentrated on their own thing in the milonga. There are plenty of helpful and outgoing people in the milonga too, but if someone does not appear so, it is better to respect their wish and their space. Let them enjoy themselves, and reserve your questions for classes.
If you see a couple sitting together in a milonga, unless they are your close friends and you're sure they won't mind, do not sit with them and do not hover around. Say hello, and move on.
 
PinkBlossom, congratulation on attending your first milonga.
I assume since you can take a class almost every day of the week, there is a fairly developed tango community, and a choice of milongas to attend in your area. If it is not the case, read the following as a general info in case you visit such a place in the future.
Not all milongas created equal. Some milongas are more pickup-y. Some have low level of dancing in general, so the partners are picked on different criteria. In some milongas people circulate more, so everyone dances more. In other milongas the group of people go to hand out together, so the newcomer won't get much action dance or social wise. A garden variety milonga outside Buenos Aires will probably have a bit of everything of the above, the difference is in what proportion.
It is the same as with the classes. Firstly, you may do your homework and research, or just go and try different places, and eventually, since there is a choice, it comes the time to become more discerning. You will come back to places where you feel better, milongas the teacher whose opinion you respect the most recommends, where mind liked people go, so you can enjoy your experience more. There will be a favorite milonga(s) , and a milonga (or several) that you never attend.
Now it is important to remember, in the milonga, same as in tango in general

not everything is as it looks/seems.

For example, you see an older women sitting and not dancing much. What is really going on here? Is she passed because of her age? Does her dancing suck? Or simply she does not care to dance with bad (in her book) partners, and those happen to be the majority of the attendees, who, btw, already know she'd turn them down, so they don't approach her. You cannot tell right away, especially when you are new.

You also noticed, that the attitude in the milonga is different from class and practicas. Some people who come to the latter to welcome newcomers and help beginners, do not go to the milonga with the same approach in mind. Hence, in class they may be more inclusive and helpful, and more selfish and concentrated on their own thing in the milonga. There are plenty of helpful and outgoing people in the milonga too, but if someone does not appear so, it is better to respect their wish and their space. Let them enjoy themselves, and reserve your questions for classes.
If you see a couple sitting together in a milonga, unless they are your close friends and you're sure they won't mind, do not sit with them and do not hover around. Say hello, and move on.
Thank you, Lilly_of_the_valley. I think you are right. I should really understand things first before I render an opinion. (And read more of this rather addictive forum!!!) :-)
 
"Older", or as I like to think of them, "more mature," people become less concerned with the "mating" / "hooking up" / competitive aspects of a social dance scene, as a general observation.

Lo de Celia Tango Club in BsAs is generally for dancers over 60 and up to 90 years. It's a competition among the women to get tandas with the best dancers. I have observed the scene for 12 years and have had many proposals, including a man of 92.

Age does not matter. This is about men and women finding companionship through dancing. Invitations for coffee or dinner after the milonga are standard. There is no avoiding it at any age.

This reminds me of a song:

You tried so many arms
when you are lonely,
to find
the one and only...
one day you turn
and he's there.
 

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