Styles anyone

Ant, there's a slight confusion here perhaps.
I wasn't talking about any sort of open hold (you know I refuse to call
anything open an embrace) but VU which results in a slight Vee-shaped,
usually upright posture with arm connections. People are insisting it fits
within the close embrace genre but it's a moot point.

Thanks, I did not take your original post in the way you have now explained above.

I often feel that I do not have a full chest connection. There is something something lacking or disconnected on my left side of the embrace. I had always put it down to the person I was dancing with not being shown the correct embrace. I did not know that this may be because they are taught that embrace by design. If that is the case I don't like it either.
 
Thought this was an interesting article on the subject.

melinas-two-cent.blogspot.com/2011/02/weve-just-returned-from-italy.html

If you can dance in very crowded conditions in close embrace, does it matter what it is called?

Conclusion: They are a mixture of styles from their training. They like to perform, ignore all dance floor rules, and expect their students to become good social dancers...

Hi Jan, for your standards somehow a mild sentence ... ;)
y´s OD
 
Surely you could say exactly the same thing about most performances by most couples?

The other day I was watching a performance by one of my teachers. It was shocking! She totally performed with moves that we had never practiced. Moves that were unsuited to the dance floor. Then a strange thing happened... I couldn't control myself. I had to do exactly what she did. I lost control of my body and started to lead a series of successively larger movements, taking over the floor. If only I hadn't watched that performance, I would still be a good social dancer today. Now all I can do is high boleos and walk backwards into line of dance. :(

The same tragic thing happened at a Lindy Hop class a few years ago. The instructors were showing off some cool aerials, and after the class it was a massacre. Every leader spontaneously threw their partner in the air. It was like no one could tell the difference between show moves and social moves.

This has to stop, it's an epidemic that is destroying dance halls everywhere.
 
Now all I can do is high boleos and walk backwards into line of dance. :(
What's the problem with walking backwards? I do that all the time as long as I have space. The line of dance is not just the circle around the dancefloor but may be any virtual one. Take a look at how (ballroom) dancers move in competitions.
 
Back to the article, I think people care too much on categorizing. I personally would consider just 2 tangos: ballroom tango and argentine tango. Postures are different, the steppings are different, even the musics are different (to some degree). On the other side, milonguero is a subset of argentine tango, nuevo a superset, and they both share common fundamental techniques.

The fun part is to mix ballroom and argentine tangos (with some paso doble) ;)
 
An article in Tango Voice (http://tangovoice.wordpress.com/tag/salon-style-tango/) distinguishes between "tango de salon" as done in BA and "salon style tango" as influenced by stage dancers in the US. The former includes milonguero/apilado as well as the V-embrace that is semi-closed but opens up a bit for turns. Both of these eschew expansive moves, ganchos and high boleos, etc.

:rolleyes:

Not a big fan of that writer. I don't particularly trust anything they say; they obviously have an axe to grind. Also, "The Voice of Tango in North America"? It doesn't get more pretentious than that. ;)
 
"Are you or have you ever been a member of the Nuevo Party? Confess!"

and a candidate for Pseuds Corner*
....."but it is culturally inaccurate. Also, at its philosophical core this perspective is in conflict with another aspect of liberal sociopolitical philosophy, the recognition that each minority culture has the right to freedom of expression without interference and imposition upon it of the values of the majority culture. Within the so-called ‘milonga’ environment of North America, the infusion of drama and the practice of multi-directional exploration of space marginalize those dancers who actually attempt to replicate the practices of the milongas of Buenos Aires,....."










* Private Eye's Listing pompous and pretentious quotations from the media.
 
Our demos

Dear Janice and everyone else, who read her post.

I'd like to reply to your post (see quoted below).

It is a DEMO! We will of course dance a differently than in a crowded Milonga. But I really think, that - compared to most other dancers - we stay quite faithful to the dance in the Salon. We do not show movements, that we do not also dance in the Milonga - apart from ONE boleo-like decoration, where I lift my feet from the floor. But we will - of course - make movements bigger and sometimes faster or slower than in a Milonga to express the music more divers. And we will not respect the line of dance during a demo. There IS no line of dance, when you are the only couple! ;-)

As for your assumption:
We do not like demos. We do them, because people want to see them and because we want to show (future) students how we dance, but we do not like them. We are actually scared of demos and very much limited in our expression. That shows in the quality of our movements, the degree of improvisation and our harmony. We will NEVER reach the same quality of dance during a performance than we do during a normal Milonga. If you would actually KNOW us, you'd not make such an assumption.

Oh yes, and: we do not train. EVER! Our style developed in accordance to what we teach. We teach walking every week, thus we walk a lot. We don't teach ganchos more than once a year, thus we don't dance Ganchos. We prepare classes by discussing contents, we listen to music, we dance at Milongas, but we never train. I wish we would, because we could surely profit from it! ;-)

If there are any questions to my original post, please ask them on my blog.

Baci,

Melina


QUOTE (Jantango):

My observations of these tango de salon teachers dancing for an audience of social dancers:
1. They enter the floor like dancers who perform, not social dancers.
2. The embrace is unusual for social dancers, more common among nuevo dancers. His left hand is above his head. Hers is in many positions except the normal embrace.
3. They pause which causes problems on a social floor.
4. They lift their feet off the floor to do kicks, a no-no on the social floor.
5. They change lanes; social dancers have to stay in a lane.
6. Most of their walking is directly down the line of dance; it's impossible on most social floors where men progress by stepping to the left, which they never do.
7. They dance opposite the line of dance.

Conclusion: They are a mixture of styles from their training. They like to perform, ignore all dance floor rules, and expect their students to become good social dancers in spite of their example. [End of QUOTE]
 
A demonstration is for the purpose of showing others your dance and what you teach. The audience is social dancers, so therefore, they don't need to see choreography for stage. What is wrong with dancing the same way you would in a milonga? If you are on the dance floor, there is a line of dance, whether it is empty or full. I suggest you look at the demos by Beto Ayala and Amanda Lucero on Youtube. He dances the same way on an empty as he does at a milonga. Beto follows the line of dance.

Ganchos are inappropriate for the social floor. They are a figure created for stage performance. Why do you bother to teach them once a year?

You might want to schedule a month in BsAs next year and see how tango is danced here.
 
Our demos

Pray, excuse my former post. I forgot the most important rule on the internet: never react to the postings of a Troll.
Which I did right now again. ;-)

Yours,

Melina
 
Dear Janice and everyone else, who read her post.

I'd like to reply to your post (see quoted below).

It is a DEMO! We will of course dance a differently than in a crowded Milonga. But I really think, that - compared to most other dancers - we stay quite faithful to the dance in the Salon. We do not show movements, that we do not also dance in the Milonga - apart from ONE boleo-like decoration, where I lift my feet from the floor. But we will - of course - make movements bigger and sometimes faster or slower than in a Milonga to express the music more divers. And we will not respect the line of dance during a demo. There IS no line of dance, when you are the only couple! ;-)

As for your assumption:
We do not like demos. We do them, because people want to see them and because we want to show (future) students how we dance, but we do not like them. We are actually scared of demos and very much limited in our expression. That shows in the quality of our movements, the degree of improvisation and our harmony. We will NEVER reach the same quality of dance during a performance than we do during a normal Milonga. If you would actually KNOW us, you'd not make such an assumption.

Oh yes, and: we do not train. EVER! Our style developed in accordance to what we teach. We teach walking every week, thus we walk a lot. We don't teach ganchos more than once a year, thus we don't dance Ganchos. We prepare classes by discussing contents, we listen to music, we dance at Milongas, but we never train. I wish we would, because we could surely profit from it! ;-)

If there are any questions to my original post, please ask them on my blog.

Baci,

Melina


QUOTE (Jantango):

My observations of these tango de salon teachers dancing for an audience of social dancers:
1. They enter the floor like dancers who perform, not social dancers.
2. The embrace is unusual for social dancers, more common among nuevo dancers. His left hand is above his head. Hers is in many positions except the normal embrace.
3. They pause which causes problems on a social floor.
4. They lift their feet off the floor to do kicks, a no-no on the social floor.
5. They change lanes; social dancers have to stay in a lane.
6. Most of their walking is directly down the line of dance; it's impossible on most social floors where men progress by stepping to the left, which they never do.
7. They dance opposite the line of dance.

Conclusion: They are a mixture of styles from their training. They like to perform, ignore all dance floor rules, and expect their students to become good social dancers in spite of their example. [End of QUOTE]
Thanks for chiming in. Great post. But save your breath, you won't make any headway. Sad, but true.
 

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