Too soon for first comp? Lots of Qs....

icequeen

New Member
How long do people usually dance before their first comp? I've mainly social danced and started taking privates not long ago, but I'd like to start competing.... is it too soon, though? Are there any negatives that come from competing "too early"?

Also, this may seem pretty stupid, but I have no idea what events to enter! There are some comps in my area coming up in July/August, and I'm confused by all the level descriptions and multi-dance, single-dance, closed/open categories. What did you guys enter at your first comps, i.e. how many heats, and what levels? I'd be doing am-am, by the way, and have been working mainly on bronze and some silver standard and latin.

Thanks everyone!
 
I,m guessing you are in the Pro/am category ( you are the amat ? )

If it be the case, take the advice of your teacher, am sure he will not put you into a category that is not within your immediate capabilities .

Warning-- it can be addictive !!! ( and lots of fun )
 
Hi there icequeen.

If you are, as you say, am/am (two amateurs) then there is not very much choice: enter the lowest level you can (pre-bronze) and at your age level. As tangotime said, your teacher should help you establish that. Am/am competition is quite tightly regulated and many of the factors below do not apply, so make sure you follow all the rules (join your amateur organization, dance only permitted steps etc etc.)

Your statement that 'there are so many levels' makes it sound as if you are going to dance with your instructor, in which case you are doing pro/am (which I do by the way). This is when it really does get very confusing and if your instructor is new to this its easy to end up in the wrong heats (we did first time). As you have probably found out, pro/am is expensive and money is always a factor (unless you are impossibly rich - in which case I know a couple you can sponsor :wink: ).

Mainly, you can make three different errors. The first is to enter too high a catagory. Bronze may not sound very high but the levels are are less about how many steps you know (which is all we focus on when we start) but how advanced your technique is. One could argue that bronze is the most difficult competition of all because you are judged almost soley on presentation and technique - for the simple reason that there are so few steps allowed all eyes are on how well you do them. Also, realize that for some competitors the idea is NOT to finish a level and move on but to stay at that level as long as they can so that they can consistently win. You are likely to meet competitors who are at bronze for 10 years or more (say hi, be nice and when ready, move up past them! Don't be perturbed because they are still winning).

Thus, if its your first competition enter the 'newcomer' heat. Here you will find a range of skills but, as far as I can guage, the judges are looking for potential as much as execution. Its also a relatively low stress environment for your first competition. By all means enter one level too - pre-bronze - where you will get some seasoned competitors. Don't make my mistake of entering silver in my first comp (think deep end - Emerald ball) thinking you know the steps. (:o was I creamed...).

Then there are all the age groups, male/female, and single/multidance events. Note that pro/am is a major money maker for competitions. I believe that these different divisions/ages/events were introduced so that one instructor could compete with many students - which benefited the students and the competition. However, watch your pocket book! It is possible to get entered into tens even a hundred different events at one competition. If you can afford it you might enjoy this - but there is no way you are going to dance your best at all of these. I like to do one round of single dances (each dance is judged separately). This is as much for warm up as for anything else - because there are so many different catagories the odds are that you will be uncontested and though it is nice to get a first place sticker its rather hollow after the first time. The real event at the syllabus dance competitions is the multidance. For adults there are usually only two or three levels (Bronze, Silver, Gold) at each style with only three age groups and women and men compete against each other (e.g. international standard, A, B and C age divisions). The multidance events typically have three different dances ( waltz tango foxtrot, or waltz foxtrot quickstep, are the most common combinations in standard). They can be a lot of fun and if you compete in your geographical area you will get to know some of the competitors.

One other catagory that you need to know about is 'closed' and 'open'. At high levels (championship) these terms mean the event is closed or open to competitors from outside the region. However, they have a different meanings in syllabus competition. A closed competition means that you can only do strict syllabus figures whereas in open you can (in theory) do anything you like. It turns out that in pro/am there really are no restrictions because if you read the rules the closed figures are limited to something like 'amateur figures plus those in any acredited dance organization'. I have never seen or even heard of a pro/am couple being cautioned or disciplined for a non-syllabus figure in a closed event. I think it a shame really but, to be honest, pro/am is never taken as seriously by competitions as the am/am events are.

I hope that is of some use - I did rather go on a bit.

Good luck in your first comp and let us know how it goes!
 
welcome...in what area do you live? (re which comps to consider)..IME, 6 months was fine...and I haven't found much of a negative to competing other than cash flow and stress...btw welcome to DF...also, we have several old threads on this if you care to do a search...I suggest typing in "first comp"...or "when ready"
 
Thanks for the helpful advice and detailed explanation! I looked up the past threads too, and found lots of great info on first comp preparation.

I think I might be more confused than I thought though.... =) Unfortunately, as a student, I don't have much $$, and will have to am-am and not pro-am. My amateur partner is more advanced and so we cannot enter newcomer, but I think we can still enter bronze together for stnd and latin. I'm confused though as to whether we should also enter silver and novice for the heck of it, and whether we should try the single dance events and multidance? Sounds like there's no great harm to trying additional heats? I am in the midwest right now, but will be relocating to the DC area next month, and the comps I'm considering are two in the DC area (Virginia State Championship in July, Capitol Dancesport in August), and possibly Kansas City Heart of America in August. Anybody with experience in any of these comps? Also, what happens if I can't afford a costume just yet?
 
Also, what happens if I can't afford a costume just yet?


Try renting one. There are threads here on that, too (rythmic rentals being one of my preferred rental sites). Also, scroll around on ballroomdancers.com as they have some inexpensive costumes, too. And if you look at some of the threads in the "Events and Ads" below, you may find some costumes for sale as well. You may get lucky and find someone who will let you pay off the costume over time, as I just happened upon.
 
I can't speak to the importance of costume in Am/Am dancing...as for the other issues...I don't see the harm in stretching to dance beyond your level as long as you don't let it hurt your self-assessment...and I would highly reccomend virginia state... we went last year, unfortunately have a vacation conflict with it this year, but Kathryn and Rosendo(organizers) are wonderful people and it was a lovely location...likely that pro and I will be there next year...have not done capitol yet but it is on the to-do list for next year
 
For amateur events at NDCA competitions there are actually two choices - the "student/student" events (sometimes called something else) which are run as part of the pro/am sessions, and the ordinary amateur events usually run in a seperate session. Ordinarily the later are a better choice, and cheaper per dance, though you do have to pay an elgibility fee to the NDCA once per year. (Naming conventions differ, you can tell the ordinary amateur events apart from the student/student ones because their form will require a registration number, and it will offer the higher level pre-champ and championship events along with the lower level ones)

In the lower levels of the regular amateur events, costumes are not even permitted by NDCA rules, though in practical terms individual competitions will sometimes permit them. But certainly not required.
 
I can't speak to the importance of costume in Am/Am dancing...as for the other issues...I don't see the harm in stretching to dance beyond your level as long as you don't let it hurt your self-assessment...and I would highly reccomend virginia state... we went last year, unfortunately have a vacation conflict with it this year, but Kathryn and Rosendo(organizers) are wonderful people and it was a lovely location...likely that pro and I will be there next year...have not done capitol yet but it is on the to-do list for next year

Are these comps with lots of amateur couples? I notice that V State has a whole day for amateur and collegiate competition, but Capitol and Heart of America seem to be mainly pro-am.

Sort of random Q: who normally qualifies for the "collegiate" classification? what happens if I'm a student, and my partner is not?
 
Are these comps with lots of amateur couples? I notice that V State has a whole day for amateur and collegiate competition, but Capitol and Heart of America seem to be mainly pro-am.

Sort of random Q: who normally qualifies for the "collegiate" classification? what happens if I'm a student, and my partner is not?

Heart of American is a mainly pro-am comp.
 
Capitol is great. It is run by John DePalma (who MCs many comps in the U.S.) and Marianne Nicole. We didn't go last year, but have gone many other years. Small fields in amateur syllabus events (maybe just 3-4 couples), but I don't think that's a bad thing for your first comp.

Not sure if we will go this year, as I teach at a college, and am latin is usually the Friday of orientation week. (It's do-able, but it means I'm driving down at the last minute and am sometimes a little stressed.) But it is definitely a comp I enjoy!
 
How long do people usually dance before their first comp? I've mainly social danced and started taking privates not long ago, but I'd like to start competing.... is it too soon, though? Are there any negatives that come from competing "too early"?

Also, this may seem pretty stupid, but I have no idea what events to enter! There are some comps in my area coming up in July/August, and I'm confused by all the level descriptions and multi-dance, single-dance, closed/open categories. What did you guys enter at your first comps, i.e. how many heats, and what levels? I'd be doing am-am, by the way, and have been working mainly on bronze and some silver standard and latin.

Thanks everyone!

Not sure about East Coast scene. But on the West Coast, with your level, I'd enter Newcomer or Prenovice. USA Dance comps always have nice competition in the syllabus events. Usually it's a nice field of 2-3 rounds (10-20+ couples). With my first partner, we went out there after 7 months (which I think it's way too long) but then we did pre-novice & novice.

These days, I'd say try to go out there after 2-3 months max with a new partner, as you'll learn that much more in a competition about what you need to work on than brewing what you think is right in the studio :) Got to take it to test drive. Your routines (as some stuff might not help you & you'll learn quickly by testing it on the comp. floor), your movement (only when comparing to others, you'll see what you want to change), etc. One coach said that 1 comp is worth 1 month of practice in the studio. I'd agree!

Treat the first few comps as practice. If you happen to get great results, wonderful. If not, so be it. It's only practice...
 
Sort of random Q: who normally qualifies for the "collegiate" classification? what happens if I'm a student, and my partner is not?

A collegiate division (or pricing package) at a "commercial" competition would probably be limited to students, and for the mixed case you'd probably want to call the organizer and ask. Also, while some events have tried to make a lot of attractive offerings, that unfortunately doesn't always mean many people are taking advantage of them.

While not explicitly your question, I'd mention that at a college-hosted competition, the events are usually open to everyone. A few of these have tried running "collegiate championship" events, but often those raise a lot of questions in the elgibility edge cases - grad students, those basically done but haven't turned in a thesis, recently graduated partners of the students, etc - for the most part, it's proved simpler and more popular to just to run amateur events open to everyone.
 
Thanks for the helpful advice and detailed explanation! I looked up the past threads too, and found lots of great info on first comp preparation.

I think I might be more confused than I thought though.... =) Unfortunately, as a student, I don't have much $$, and will have to am-am and not pro-am. My amateur partner is more advanced and so we cannot enter newcomer, but I think we can still enter bronze together for stnd and latin. I'm confused though as to whether we should also enter silver and novice for the heck of it, and whether we should try the single dance events and multidance? Sounds like there's no great harm to trying additional heats? I am in the midwest right now, but will be relocating to the DC area next month, and the comps I'm considering are two in the DC area (Virginia State Championship in July, Capitol Dancesport in August), and possibly Kansas City Heart of America in August. Anybody with experience in any of these comps? Also, what happens if I can't afford a costume just yet?

i competed in newcomer two months after i learned my first step. nothing like throwing yourself into the deepend.
if you're going to be in DC, and especially if you are a student, then DCDI, held at the U of Maryland is probably the best comp to go to. the field's huge (i mean if that's what you're looking for, competition... and people throw around the "one of the largest comps on the east coast" tag all the time for it) and the comp is great. plus, if you're a student, get involved with one of the collegiate teams here (UMD, GTown, or GW). we're all fun kids, and we can give you a great idea for competitions in the area.
my theory has always been if it's all the same money-wise, try whatever you can... it'll give you a better idea of where you are as a couple.
DC's a great place for ballroom... the community here is great. solid choice... though i'm a bit biased :P
 

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