That's because there is an oversupply of people of average ability trying to turn their hobby into a career.
What makes you cringe in tango?
- Thread starter TTanguero
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That's because there is an oversupply of people of average ability trying to turn their hobby into a career.
JournalInTime
Forum Master
Yes. This is precisely why I have resisted deciding to teach.
Teachers in my local tango scene include a good number of genuine career dancers who've graduated from dance academies, earned a BFA or even an MFA in dance, had tenures with acclaimed dance troupes and companies, etc. It's almost all in ballet and contemporary, and almost none in AT . . . but at that level, "dance is dance." Their years of professional – not hobbyist or casual social – experience vary, but "10 to 30+ years, on average around 20 years" would be fair. My coach, for instance, graduated from a ballet academy, toured with both a circus and a traveling tango show for decades, founded tango schools in two countries, and has been a tango instructor for close to 35 years, on top of being a highly certified Pilates and yoga instructor.
Next to that, "social dance guy for 12 1/2 years" doesn't cut it. Sure, those 12 1/2 years have been intensive and have involved hundreds of hours a year of lessons, drills, and practice, at one point reaching the pitch of a part-time job and even becoming a part-time job as a junior assistant. But that's nothing next to the real teachers here . . . I couldn't fake it anywhere outside of a village of a few hundred non-dancers. Although I am pursuing formal apprenticeship as a teacher, that's for self-fulfillment – to help me structure and put words to things I do intuitively – and I don't seriously see myself teaching, ever.
And yet there are people who've followed an arc similar to mine who have decided – after 10, or just 5, or as few as 3 years as social dancers – to call themselves tango teachers. These "Temu tango teachers" are doing the real ones no favors.
Not necessarily. Given that social AT teachers aren't 'qualified', some just wish to encourage others to dance AT. Obviously it depends where you are, but in an AT regional 'desert', that may not be so bad IF they recognise their limitations and seek to improve their technical and teaching skills.
Nevertheless you make a good point in some locations where some are just looking for any extra income. You also get the 'Argentinians', not necessarily great at teaching, and not in the elite ranks, who make their mark, and move on. Sometimes they leave wreckage behind; sometimes they return to milk it financially. A few are noteworthy, and good, conscientious, teachers for workshops regular lessons.
I guess it depends whether or not there's a vacancy which can be filled - and candidates are limited.
the tangotopics guy began teaching after 1 year. I checked some of his vids out and he over explains things imo.
brujo
Well-Known Member
I think it also speaks to what is valued in society. My conga teacher used to say that in Canada a lot of musicians had a day job and then went home and played their instruments as a hobby, whereas in Cuba the better students would attend percussion and folklore schools supported by the government, given the significant economic benefits that exporting that bit of culture would bring. This also meant that there was demand for more teachers for art as a viable career choice. It also means better curriculums for continuing the arts as there is better pedagogy. In the states I have met people that got started dancing as a part of programs preventing kids from getting into gangs and such, but they are small and far between.
You kinda see this as a criticism in Argentina too, where the government has tango as a cultural attraction but then doesn’t really invest much in fostering or growing it as much as say, soccer. Sometimes the fields align, with school teachers also having tango as a hobby and then using those skills to build up the programs but very often people that are great dancers are not great teachers.
The smaller communities generally are too small to support full time teachers anyway so theres no real question of trying to become a full time professional there.
IMO the most valuable thing teachers/organizers actually do is community building by organizing events and recruiting new people. And one doesn't need to be a high level dancer or teacher for that, but rather good interprsonal skills are more important.
brujo
Well-Known Member
People move a lot these days. A lot of the bigger community teachers I know started learning and building a reputation in the smaller cities and then move to the bigger cities. Similarly, a lot of the teachers in the smaller communities learned in the big cities and then moved to the smaller places for work or school.
There are also a lot of folks willing to travel for dance. I know people from communities that have frequent practicas and classes with eight or ten folks in their cities, and they will often drive two hours each way just to go to milongas and workshops. They bring the ideas to their own practicas and such and it really helps then grow the local community to the point it is sustainable.
A lot of times the cost of living is lower in the smaller communities to the point that if someone has a military pension or a working spouse, the side hustle income is enough to sustain them as full time teachers.
That's because partner dance, in general, is social. The competition to be the best isn't necessary, but dancers can still be dissatisfied with their own dance skills. You outgrow the skills of the local scene and its teachers, and seek workshops, courses, etc, elsewhere (BsAs isn't necessary), and return home. Through circumstances we were fortunate to learn a lot through spending time in a metropolis with several AT groups. Maybe you pass on what you've learned. Maybe you gain better skills to dance with beginners and novices. The elite, formal, milonga doesn't apply, but there may still be a clique who develop their own rules. That's the human condition. And then you travel to events.
But you have to recognise the market there and whether it can grow with more, and better, teachers, milongas and prácticas. It's also necessary to recognise own limitations and what it requires to teach!
Off topic, but interesting, and sound, advice on a radio programme some days ago about unaffordable housing costs from an entrepreneur who had built up a large rental housing stock from nothing to someone who couldn't afford to buy in the metropolis, despite well-paid job and age: Move somewhere cheaper where you can afford it.
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The lack of self-awareness from someone actively engaged in making the problem worse in that quote is depressing
Off topic, but I need to provide some defence: Actually he seemed very aware, having started in a similar position and worked his way up by buying a wreck, doing it up, and selling it to do the same on another. So he added value. He was also extremely conscientious about checking his tenants were satisfied and dealing with problems. He could now afford the rural abode himself, but still visited all tenants regularly to check and fix problems.
So, I personally felt he was doing a good job in the face of the complex problem of people seeking a profit from their property. Simplistic solutions don't fix that complex problem. It's as naïve as that politician who wanted all schools to be above average, or media executives in the UK thinking the only culture is in London.
itwillhappen
Forum Master
I don't know anyone who has made a "career" like that. What would such a thing even look like? I also don't see any reason for the implicit assumption that "teacher" is a profession, while organizer, community builder, host, and DJ are hobbies.
As a general rule of thumb, anyone who dedicates their time for little or no money, and thus ultimately loses out, is beneficial to the tango community.
If someone is trying to make a living out of doing any of those activities then it can be called making a career.
I have seen a few examples locally where people have dived into tango and tried to make career out of it. Sometimes sense prevailed and after a few years they went back into the job market while keeping tango as side activity.
Creating a career is multi-faceted. It's not just 'teaching', or organising a milonga/practica, or 'dj' some playlist, or community builder and dealing with all the issues within a group. Sure, you can offload, or delegate, some. However it still comes down to an insufficient market to pay for the effort involved, never mind a 'living', in many locales.
So you have to work within the limitations, including your own. The key question is what gets more people participating to get it beyond that critical size? And it's failing.
We know there's a drop-off. People get bored, it's too difficult, ... we get old; we die. The original, historical, motivation has gone. Competition to be the elite 'best' hasn't fixed BR (nor other similar 'sports'). It's too simplistic to blame old códigos, but IMHO strict adherence doesn't help. Nor do elite cliques. My guess is that it's about having the 'society' (the 'club') that's wanted in that locale. So it requires a special kind of community-builder rather than just a 'teacher'. And there's no funding for that job.
I have seen some instructors (in tango, WCS, Salsa, Bachata, etc) very successfully build new community, bring in a lot of new dancers, integrate them into the scene. All that I seen did it as a hobby or side gig. None were trying to make a living do that. They had full time job unrelated to their hobby.
I also seen instructors in Tango trying to make it a career struggle to build sustainable following. They try to be ultra competitive, cunning, ruthless and people don’t like that.
brujo
Well-Known Member
Oddly enough every case of a good community building I’ve seen has been from a woman and all the ego driven ones that have failed have been from men.