When do you stop being a beginner?

[twnkltoz]

You're not a beginner anymore when you quit blaming your partner for the quality of your dance. Or, has that already been said?

Great one!

 

[Nathan]

I think it's just a case of numbers. When there are more women than men in the community, the women put up with more in order to get to dance at all. If there were a place where men far outnumber the women, the women would probably be a lot less tolerant, because they would get to dance even if they snubbed the offenders.

I agree, and I'll add that it has an impact on the quality of dancing in the community. Like in Buenos Aires a long time ago, when there was a shortage of women to dance with, men competed and trained and practiced in order to secure dances. When the opposite situation arises, men tend to get complacent and lose their drive to improve. The whole scene suffers as a result.

Personally, I don't put up with blaming, no matter who is doing it. If an experienced teacher can give you instruction without it coming off as blame (even in a setting where clearly you are at fault) then there's no excuse for one of your own peers to have any attitude other than "WE are having this problem in the dance.. How can WE fix it?"

If only everyone had such an attitude, the tango world would be a much better place. :smile:

 

[LadyLeader]

I agree, and I'll add that it has an impact on the quality of dancing in the community. Like in Buenos Aires a long time ago, when there was a shortage of women to dance with, men competed and trained and practiced in order to secure dances. When the opposite situation arises, men tend to get complacent and lose their drive to improve. The whole scene suffers as a result.

I feel deep respect for those men for 100 years ago! They managed a difficult situation by concentrating on skill development and controlling the access to pista.
They could instead have started to compete in fancy shoes, fantastic outfits or developed strategies for how to choose their place at milonga and so on.....

We have here a situation where a follower class has maybe 5-10 participants; in a city where ONE organizer has 900 members. I am also sure that no one of these followers are training at home. I have heard that in Poland and Russia followers go to weekly training during several years. Great for those leaders and for the follower bodies with correct technique!

(Leaders dream about a milonga where all the followers have minimum 3 years training, several nights per week and only the ones who got sisters approval are on the pista! If you make a mistake they softly blame themselves as men did for 100 years ago ...)

 

[sixela]

This is more something we have to tell to our follower pupils. Shut up and follow whatever he may lead, instead of telling him "This is not the sequence"

That usually gets a very prompt reply from me: "Of course it's not the sequence. How can I know if I'm leading you correctly if you're just running on autopilot? I'll sometimes lead the sequence and I'll sometimes lead something else, and I'm not going to tell you when".

They either smile and go with the flow (and some even enjoy not having to dance The Sequence like a broken record for an hour on end), others then insist you stick to The Sequence Because the Teacher Knows Best and They Paid to Learn It and Nothing Else. I'm usually rather tolerant, but the latter behaviour crosses them off my list for future workshops.

 

[Zsana]

That usually gets a very prompt reply from me: "Of course it's not the sequence. How can I know if I'm leading you correctly if you're just running on autopilot? I'll sometimes lead the sequence and I'll sometimes lead something else, and I'm not going to tell you when".

Yes that is great I love that so much more useful than repeating The Sequence... but when the lead never is The Sequence... that is another issue and might worth telling it.

but the latter behaviour crosses them off my list for future workshops.

HAHA! I do feel sympathetic

 

[newbie]

but when the lead never is The Sequence... that is another issue and might worth telling it.

"Can you just do the sequence, stupid?"
Once by the teacher (I was navigating to an area of the dancefloor with more space) and once by the partner (there were pauses in the music, and instead of the 1,2, 3 etc of the sequence I was doing 1, 2, pause, pause, pause, 3 etc)