What are the 5 top reasons that make a man ask a woman to dance? Beauty comes first?

It doesn't even have to be "significant" - even 10% will cause a massive problem.

Say you have an event with 100 people, and you have 55 women and 45 men. In other words, only 10% imbalance. That will mean that - at best - 10 women are always sitting out, all the time.

But it gets worse. Imagine that 10 men and 10 women want to sit out a tanda. Then you have 35 men and 45 women - the relative ratio has gone up again. And say 10 men want to dance with only one partner - 25 / 35... and so on.

And for a 20% imbalance, it's horrible. Imagine a 40/60 split, so you have at least a full third of the women sitting it out, all the time - and more likely, half of them - whether they want to or not.

A relatively-small imbalance can have very large effects.

isnt this similar to Zeno's paradox and eventually everyone will be sitting down?*




*One of Zeno's best known paradoxes is the story of the race between Achilles and the tortoise, which Zeno uses to help prove his theory that motion is impossible (Fearn, 2001). In this story the tortoise, obviously much slower than Achilles, gets a head start in the race. For example, the tortoise gets a 10 foot head start. Achilles then begins the race and quickly covers the 10 feet that the tortoise previously covered and continues to get closer to the tortoise. However, by the time that Achilles covered the 10 feet the tortoise has covered 2 more feet. Achilles then covers the 2 feet that tortoise covered, but in that time the tortoise manages to cover another small distance which Achilles will inevitably have to cover before catching up to the tortoise.
 
It's called a gender imbalance. Example, if at a milonga there are 40 followers and only 20 leaders, half of the followers will be sitting at any given time (assuming that the followers don't also lead).


BTW, for the followers, I did some quick math (probability), and it's made me realize how bad it can be for you when there is a significant gender imbalance.

If we consider the hypothetical scenario that random chance is how the followers are picked for each tanda (and the gender imbalance is a 2 - 1 ratio), then it's very possible (if not likely) that it would take 6 tandas for each follower to have danced at least once (if you're not a math geek, just bare with me on this). In this same scenario, some other follower would likely have danced every tanda, and other followers would have danced varying numbers of tandas.

Now we know that the follower selection is not random, and also, most leaders will not dance every tanda, so when the gender imbalance is large, it's easy to see how someone could sit out the whole night (if they don't do anything to change the odds).

My conclusion, leaders need to do more to ask different people to dance.

Yay, you! Could you please email this to every Tango leader in existence?

So, there's this really sweet lady who has been around our Tango community for quite some time and is very good. She lines up women to dance with my DH (with my enthusiastic permission) to make sure he's having a good experience and getting in plenty of practice. I thanked her the other night for that, and in the course of her reply, she said, "...but you're so wonderful, I don't need to do that for you!" I was like...you're kidding me, right?? LOL! It was a sweet compliment, though, even if what she really meant was "You're a follower, and therefore competition. You're on your own, b!tch." I'm mostly kidding about that. I like her a lot, and she's been extremely nice and encouraging to us since the very first night. I just thought it was hilarious that she would think I'm tearing up the dance floor, tanda after tanda!
 
isnt this similar to Zeno's paradox and eventually everyone will be sitting down?*




*One of Zeno's best known paradoxes is the story of the race between Achilles and the tortoise, which Zeno uses to help prove his theory that motion is impossible (Fearn, 2001). In this story the tortoise, obviously much slower than Achilles, gets a head start in the race. For example, the tortoise gets a 10 foot head start. Achilles then begins the race and quickly covers the 10 feet that the tortoise previously covered and continues to get closer to the tortoise. However, by the time that Achilles covered the 10 feet the tortoise has covered 2 more feet. Achilles then covers the 2 feet that tortoise covered, but in that time the tortoise manages to cover another small distance which Achilles will inevitably have to cover before catching up to the tortoise.
Are you thinking about Terry Pratchett? Cuz I'm thinking about Terry Pratchett! LOL.
 
isnt this similar to Zeno's paradox and eventually everyone will be sitting down?*

*One of Zeno's best known paradoxes is the story of the race between Achilles and the tortoise, which Zeno uses to help prove his theory that motion is impossible (Fearn, 2001). In this story the tortoise, obviously much slower than Achilles, gets a head start in the race. For example, the tortoise gets a 10 foot head start. Achilles then begins the race and quickly covers the 10 feet that the tortoise previously covered and continues to get closer to the tortoise. However, by the time that Achilles covered the 10 feet the tortoise has covered 2 more feet. Achilles then covers the 2 feet that tortoise covered, but in that time the tortoise manages to cover another small distance which Achilles will inevitably have to cover before catching up to the tortoise.
Well, if you assume constant velocity for both, then Achilles would catch the tortoise at 12.5 feet.

poke.gif
 
Now I dance well enough to have leaders enjoy dancing with me at many milongas/practicas. When I went to a popular milonga, and had to sit out most of the night, I started to become suspicious whether I stink that night. Am I suffering paranoia?
 
Now I dance well enough to have leaders enjoy dancing with me at many milongas/practicas. When I went to a popular milonga, and had to sit out most of the night, I started to become suspicious whether I stink that night. Am I suffering paranoia?

I hear you. I have been doing really well the past few weeks...most nights, I dance at least every other tanda, which makes me very happy, and last Wednesday I danced almost the whole night and barely sat at all. Last night, I was exhausted and my feet were killing me by the end of the night from all the dancing (always a good sign!). Tonight, I got almost no love. It's still a mystery to me how the priorities change from one night to the next with basically the same group of people. Ah, well, it was only one night and most nights I go home floating on a cloud of tango euphoria, so I'm trying to not be too petulant about it.
 
I hear you. I have been doing really well the past few weeks...most nights, I dance at least every other tanda, which makes me very happy, and last Wednesday I danced almost the whole night and barely sat at all. Last night, I was exhausted and my feet were killing me by the end of the night from all the dancing (always a good sign!). Tonight, I got almost no love. It's still a mystery to me how the priorities change from one night to the next with basically the same group of people. Ah, well, it was only one night and most nights I go home floating on a cloud of tango euphoria, so I'm trying to not be too petulant about it.

Thanks. :p
 
When I went to a popular milonga, and had to sit out most of the night, I started to become suspicious whether I stink that night. Am I suffering paranoia?

Reminds me of what a former partner once said.
"It's strange... I am sitting."

True, it only lasted five minutes before she was invited again.
 
Yeah, been there. And even though I now dance as much as I want/am able to most of the time, I still get those nights occasionally.

Milonga's Law:

"The more you really really want to dance, the less you get asked."*







*Of course, on nights you get asked lots you don't sit there being mad for a dance as you're busy, well, dancing.
 
10 top reasons

... After 8 years of salsa dancing, I’ve started tango lessons in the last January. Of course I also go to the milongas and I've been observing it. In my opinion, it is not the mastery in dancing that comes as the first reason when a man invites a woman to dance. Rather than that, beauty/or a very short mini-skirt is the key point. I'm I wrong? I'm I being too innocent, because this is no big news since it's like that from the beginning of the world? Well, in tango you get so involved with your classes and perfecting/practicing your dance moves that you tend to think that if you dance better people will invite you more. But it seems that it is not always the case, no?
If I'm right, this can be very cruel to ageing women ... By the way, I'm 40 years old.

P.S. - In salsa it's a bit true, but people tend to mingle more with each other, despite of the age/beauty issue.

10 top reasons according to survey results posted @

http://tangoreviews.com/2011/08/20/...rations-in-asking-a-follower-to-dance-part-1/


10 MOST COMMON CONSIDERATIONS IN ASKING A FOLLOWER TO DANCE (WHAT MEN WANT!)
  • She can create a comfortable close embrace.
Not surprisingly, this statement was the one most often described by leaders as “Very Important” (59%) or “Important” (29%) – combining for almost 90% of survey respondents. This does not surprise me at all. Without any strict definition of “close embrace,” I would like to simply describe it as the quintessence of tango. The embrace, hugging each other with awareness, taking responsibility for sharing unforgettable moments, creating a connection that leads us to feel and enjoy tango within ourselves – that is what this dance is all about. Sometimes at the milongas I just like to sit and listen to the music and watch people dance. What I observe is not only the footwork, but how playful a couple is within the music or how technically good they are. Throughout, the expressions on their faces tell whether they’re suffering through the tanda or sharing a blissful moment. In fact, if you’re at a milonga and looking for prospective candidates to dance with, watch the faces of their partners. One look will tell all about the embrace.
  • She follows what I lead, as opposed to trying to back-lead me.
“You follow, I lead” Chicho stated clearly during one of the intermediate/advanced classes that I took at the recent Tango Element Festival in Baltimore. I guess, watching some of us students, he might not have gotten a really clear feeling as to who was leading and who was following. We as followers should be thankful that most of the leading work is not our assignment. Forty-six per cent (46%) of leaders felt that a follower’s following skills are a “Very Important” factor in inviting someone to dance. I totally agree because leading a lady who does not quite understand her role on the floor can be awkward, to say the least. Leaders will not be enthusiastic about asking her to dance in the future and followers who can’t resist the temptation to back-lead will find fewer leaders inviting them. To be sure, there were a few leaders (3%) who did not consider good following ability all that important, but I can’t help but wonder what they were thinking. So ladies, I am pretty sure that most of us can say: ” I’ll follow, IF you lead.” Just don’t actually say it!
  • She has been enthusiastic dance partner in the past and she is happy to dance with me
How important are a warm smile and an enthusiastic attitude towards a man asking us to dance? Well, 41% of men chose “Very Important“ in response to this question and another 47% weren’t far behind with “Important” – together coming in at almost 90%. Many of us often arrive at a milonga after a long day at work, perhaps not very happy or frustrated at the way the day went. But whatever the day was like, we come to the milonga to relax and have fun, to forget about any personal, business, or relationship problems. We want to enjoy the music, dance, and share some small talk with friends. Asking a woman to dance and having her accept a man’s invitation with a glowing smile and cheerful attitude is a great start. Add lovely music and some playful tandas and the glow only gets better.
  • She has generally good hygiene, pleasant perfume, etc
Oh yeah! There is no doubt about it. Good hygiene is common sense and good for everyone. On the other hand, the lack of it stands out markedly. It is very noticeable and it’s really uncomfortable dancing with someone who has not seen a shower for awhile. To be honest, I have had this kind of unpleasant experience only once at a milonga. But, no matter how good his level of the dancing was, I probably would avoid the cabeceo or any verbal invitation from this guy for a long time (as in forever!). According to our statistics, 32% of men believe that it plays a “Very Important” role in asking for a dance, 35% consider it “Important” and only 3% think it’s “Not Important.” I have to wonder though about the 5% who don’t consider personal hygiene a factor at all – what are they thinking? Well, ladies let’s put on a few drops of Vera Wang’s Lovestruck, Marc Jacobs’ Oh, Lola!, Giorgio Armani’s Aqua di Glola or any other favorite perfume to please ourselves and our dance partners.
  • She is NOT chewing gum (and she wouldn’t continue to chew incessantly in my ear)
H’mmm? 51% of leaders who took our survey claim that they are not happy dancing with a woman who chews gum while dancing. Interesting. I never thought that chewing gum could distract a leader so much. You may not realize that you make a really irritating sound when you smack your gum, especially when your mouth is positioned up against your partner’s ear. I totally understand that chewing gum is a good way to freshen your breath and keep your mouth free from bacteria (chewing gum stimulates salivary glands to produce more saliva which helps wash away food particles and bacteria). But, let’s follow some common manners and don’t chew gum when you dance. I’m pretty sure your partner will appreciate it and you will be more likely to focus on your dancing. It’s rumored that some people can’t dance and chew gum at the same time. Nevertheless, if you need some sort of oral fix, try a breath mint!
  • She follows very well, even though she’s only a beginner.
I am happy to say it aloud – the level of a follower’s dancing is not all that important for 74% of leaders responding. They will still ask you beginners to dance IF you follow well. I remember when I started dancing tango. At the beginning, it was not easy to attract a partner with significant tango experience. Of course, we were all beginners once and we all came up with some ways to get better leaders to occasionally dance with us. I don’t have a magical solution for those of you who just got into the tango community and want to improve their tango level really quickly. You could practice a lot with someone who is a bit better than you and hope that some good leaders will take note. Alternatively, you can try a shorter dress. That usually works, except for the 12% who responded, “Don’t consider it at all,” regarding the question about sexy outfits. Yeah, right?!
  • I’ve seen her dance before and I know how her dancing is
Oh, yes. This is a common way to decide with whom to dance, if you don’t already know each other or if you see some new followers at a milonga. How many leaders use this rule commonly? 27% of those who took our survey declared that it is “Very Important” for them to see us followers in action; 34% pay enough attention to it to have chosen the “Important” option – so, more than 60% of men will check out your dancing before risking a tanda. I am glad to see that 10% say that it doesn’t matter that much or that they don’t consider it at all – though that minority may be nearsighted and clueless. The downside, of course, occurs when you are an experienced follower but you are “a new face” at a particular tango venue or you are attending a milonga for the first time. Nobody knows you and you do not know anyone. You want to be asked to dance, but all the leaders want to see you dance first. It’s a conundrum. Alternatively, you can try a shorter dress. Short dresses do cover a lot of shortcomings!
  • She has declined my invitation in the past on several occasions (and this is my chance for payback).
Am I touching on the male ego here? Hopefully not, but it looks like 20% of leaders who chose the answer, “Very Important,” have a good memory of who rejected them before and may have an axe to grind. Well, if you take this personally, not getting a “YES” from a lady may bruise your ego, but according to Ney Melo’s article, “The Do’s and Don’t’s of Inviting and Accepting,” rejection is not a bad thing. As long as you can use it as encouragement to improve, you win because it forces you to make your tango better. There was a moment when I said “NO” several times to someone whose dancing was actually as good as mine at the time. It seems I upset him quite a lot. We both have significantly improved our tango since then, but now I guess he’s been using his chance for payback ever since. I am still waiting for his, “Shall we dance?” This is not to say that you should accept every dance from everyone every time. But, if you’re going to reject an invitation, do it without attitude and try to do it graciously enough so that you don’t slam the door on future invitations.
  • She has initiated the cabeceo to me.
The “cabeceo” is the traditional tango method of inviting a dance strictly by eye contact. It’s an excellent way of avoiding a negative verbal answer and a possibly embarrassing moment. It is used by both women and man and either can initiate the contact. A nod of the head, a gracious smile, or a simple wink seals the deal. Based on our statistics, cabeceo is very important for 18% of leaders; 41% of leaders probably use the cabeceo and/or a verbal invitation, depending on whom they invite and whether or not that person uses the cabeceo. To be sure, sometimes the cabeceo might be misinterpreted by one of the parties. The situation can become awkward if you happen to look over at someone without necessarily intending a cabeceo and then suddenly find the person standing in front of you waiting for you to get on the dance floor, thinking you had cabeceo’d him. At that point, you can either get up and dance or simply explain the misunderstanding. But in general, cabeceo does work well. Personally, the cabeceo works best for me when I use it to invite or accept dances from friends or people who I know. It’s like an understanding that you instantaneously create with someone that signals both the invitation to dance and the acceptance, with no awkwardness or guilt. Whenever you go out dancing locally, try to use it. In Buenos Aires, you had better use it.
  • She is a more advanced dancer, much better than the dancers I normally dance with.
We all want to improve the level of our tango. There are many ways to do that. One of them is to invite dancers who dance much better than the people you usually invite – getting out of your comfort zone. To be sure, at some point it is a challenge to meet a partner’s expectations and it can feel intimidating at times, but 15% of leaders bravely answered this question as “Very Important;” 24% considered it “Important,” and only 8% responded “Does not consider it at all.” So it seems, guys will risk their egos to dance with dancers better than themselves – which is good. It’s the best way to get better. Now we’ve got to look at how many better followers will accept dances from leaders who aren’t up to their level. Stay tuned!
Aga Mroz, Joe Wieder​
 

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