Dave Bailey
Active Member
Yes, exactly the way I see it.
Spookily, I've got a version of that diagram I drew up myself, independently - yours is better though.
A good sylabus for close embrace Tango learning
- Thread starter Mario7
- Start date
Spookily, I've got a version of that diagram I drew up myself, independently - yours is better though.
This might be first post of yours that I disagree with in part (a little). Basically, that means I really like your posts.
(and now, back to my usual whining and nonsense)
While the flight may only be $500, he might also want to sleep inside and eat every day (not to mention, still have a job to come back to).
Mario's basic problem (if I understand it correctly) is he doesn't have an established community where he is, that likes to dance close embrace.
His options are to:
1 Whine about it (AKA do nothing).
2 Leave and go somewhere else.
3 Find some people with similar interest and try to learn together (and hopefully build a close embrace tango community).
I think his choice is the best option for him, and in time, hopefully it will also benefit others in his area. Sure, he'll make some mistakes along the way, but that doesn't mean he can't eventually succeed in his endeavor. Sure, I think he should go to Buenos Aires if he can, but unless he's leaving his area for good, he will simply return to the same situation.
As for the sacada, I don't know enough about Mario's dance to say what the real issue is, but one possibility is that he might not be good enough at being able to see everything that's going on when watching video. I've had that issue in the past, an occasionally it still re-occurs. You see something you like, and it may not be all that difficult (once you know it), but you keep goofing it up because of some detail you keep missing when watching the video (for me, it often comes down to foot positioning). Eventually, once you've seen most of the steps you are interested in, this becomes less of a problem (at least it did for me).
tangonuevo
New Member
Although I generally like your posts, I'm not so sure about this one. The oft inferred implication is that if you are dancing big and flashy, it is for the entertainment of others, while if it is just for yourself and your partner, you will dance "conservatively."
I'm a skier. I love to ski bumps and don't care if anyone is watching - I just love the physicality and the feeling. I'm a rock climber and sometimes take risks not because I'm trying to impress anyone - but simply because I love the feeling. As a dancer, I like to dance big, as does my partner, and we don't care if anyone is watching. In fact, one nice thing about having a dance floor in our home is that we can dance as big as we wish without being subject to the prejudice that says we are only doing so to impress.
bordertangoman
Well-Known Member
Are you talking about a low sacada or a high sacada? The low ones are fairly easy for the follower (as they can be mostly an illusion). If you are talking about the high sacada, then I am more in agreement with you.
newbie
Well-Known Member
What is a high sacada?
I would like to know your thoughts on this as I've heard different views and I myself have played with different ideas.
I'm not sure what you're asking... are you asking me to comment further on my own post or asking others to comment on my post?
Lui
Active Member
In my world Skodas are cars made by a branch of the Volkswagen group. My sister drives one. Never seen one on the dance floor though.
I agree, that it will take about several month or even years for followers to develop an “relaxed” leg. On the other hand flowers will learn to receive an average forward sacada in 5 minutes, given they have already a decent walk and ochos and are dancing with a professional dancer. Leaders will take about 1 to 2 lessons to get going. You can learn incredible fast, once everything is explained in details and combined with an throughout training system. The trick is to find such a teacher.
In my opinion learning from video is rather hard, as many aspects, like the lead, can’t be experienced nor questioned. While a sacada is easy to learn one on one, its very difficult to learn just from video. For me all scadas are low keeping the followers foot on the floor, but that might be a question of semantics.
There are more options, than just three. Inviting some teacher/Milonguero/skilled person to that place for example, but yes there will be costs involved most likely. As the old saying goes; “The only thing free in life is death”. Frequently, I encounter students struggling to unlearn something they have made up by them self, inspired by the internet. It’s just such a waste of energy and the ladies are often at the painful end.
I agree, that it will take about several month or even years for followers to develop an “relaxed” leg. On the other hand flowers will learn to receive an average forward sacada in 5 minutes, given they have already a decent walk and ochos and are dancing with a professional dancer. Leaders will take about 1 to 2 lessons to get going. You can learn incredible fast, once everything is explained in details and combined with an throughout training system. The trick is to find such a teacher.
In my opinion learning from video is rather hard, as many aspects, like the lead, can’t be experienced nor questioned. While a sacada is easy to learn one on one, its very difficult to learn just from video. For me all scadas are low keeping the followers foot on the floor, but that might be a question of semantics.
There are more options, than just three. Inviting some teacher/Milonguero/skilled person to that place for example, but yes there will be costs involved most likely. As the old saying goes; “The only thing free in life is death”. Frequently, I encounter students struggling to unlearn something they have made up by them self, inspired by the internet. It’s just such a waste of energy and the ladies are often at the painful end.
Lilly_of_the_valley
Well-Known Member
Lilly_of_the_valley
Well-Known Member
As for options, traveling to Buenos Aires is one.
Organizing a trip to Buenos Aires for a group of local tango community members might be another.
Inviting teachers, organizing workshops is what lots of people who live in tango deserts and are eager to learn and create the community, do.
It is impossible to learn tango using mostly videos and internet discussion board.
If there is no way to learn tango in your area, take up salsa or swing instead.
Organizing a trip to Buenos Aires for a group of local tango community members might be another.
Inviting teachers, organizing workshops is what lots of people who live in tango deserts and are eager to learn and create the community, do.
It is impossible to learn tango using mostly videos and internet discussion board.
If there is no way to learn tango in your area, take up salsa or swing instead.
By a "high sacada" are you referring to a castigada or leg wrap rather than just a step that displaces the follower by stepping into her spot and creating the illusion by moving her body?
With the high sacada there is a true displacement and light contact that typically occurs above the follower's knee. The low sacada doesn't require contact, but if it does occur, it's below the knee. The follower can do a quick leg wrap embellishment, but I wouldn't call it a castigada (although I might be wrong on that).
BTW, I didn't make up the high vs low sacada thing. One of my teachers (an Argentine who now lives in Boston) explained it to me. Of course I've also talked to a few people who said that only one (or the other type) was the only "true" sacada.
My favorite is an "in line" or "linear" sacada in an apilado embrace. The man literally steps straight into the woman, between her legs. Contact occurs between the man's outer thigh against the woman's inner thigh.
VERY important to have a good connection and be moving well together to pull it off.
VERY important to have a good connection and be moving well together to pull it off.
Hmm - to be honest i don't find that modern tango requires more technical skill - i can do a decent imitation of open embrace nuevo with a follower who has danced for maybe 1 or 2 years, while i find that dancing inventive and musical CE on one squarefoot requires a degree of connection, awareness and active following and precision that only very few followers have. A open embrace inline boleo in the line of dance is easy, a close embrace in line boleo between my legs is difficult.
Gssh