A hold/connection question for leaders

L

lynn

New Member
I had a class last week and in trying to figure out what being a good follower entails, I decided to try to be a leader for one class. I have a question for the leaders: how much "pressure" (for lack of better term) are you expecting from the ladies' left arm? Now, having danced with different followers, I've had ladies putting their hands so gently on my right arm that I can barely feel their presence and on the other extreme, I've had folowers pretty much putting their entire body weight on me. I've often been told to have toned arms (not like spaghetti, of course) in order to have good connection. I know the answer probably varies from person to person but I'm hoping to get some feedback as to what the experts on DF interprets the term "toned arm".

Thanks!
 
My personal preference...

Enough resistance in the arms to turn you around
if you were pushed with one finger on the elbow
in dance hold position while standing on a ball
(or sitting on an office chair or some platform that would freely rotate).


madmaximus
 
you have to feel it, but it shouldn't be a fight who can press harder. It should be not only a lay down of the arm at the leader. I like to feel that she is conscious that she has an arm there, which can be a good part of dancing. - that were my ballroom experiences, but that's already a few years back. So maybe someone is a little more uptodate on that. :D
luh
 
You want your arms toned such that you can feel the man's input. If you're not toned at all (spaghetti arms) you won't feel a damn thing. If you have the Grip of Death, you may not feel a subtle lead. The man does not want to have to push you around.

We also don't want your body weight laying on us. Keep your weight to yourself, please. If you are not balanced in your dance position when the man leaves your frame, that means he is having to support you.
 
I must say the one very nice thing about being buff as a linebacker (despite how bad it looks in a gown) is that I have had several gentlemen compliment me on my frame and on being light to hold....having said that, I am now aware of how often going into promenade or taking off on a free spin I will push off on my poor instructor or lean on him...thank goodness the poor guy is fit
 
Great article, thanks, Vince!

I've always struggled to find the right "balance" - between having spaghetti arms and being overly stiff, thank you all for your wonderful comments!
 
you can also look at it as being "reactive"

give only as much pressure as you are given by the man. that is... assuming the man is doing the right thing and not pushing the lady around.

if the man has a good frame and is not pushing then apply as much pressure as he is applying in order to keep the conneciton between you "neutral". if the man is asking for more pressure he's probably planning on executing a move that requires more "connection". if his lead lightens up then he's probably asking you not to go anywhere.

be attentive to the way the man moves his body, connect accordingly and then move your body.
 
Hmm, let's see if i can put down on paper (or keyboard) what i'm experiencing so far: Usually when I dance with a man who has pretty good frame, he will lead a move with his body than his arm. In other words, i feel his body moving forwards/backwards earlier than i can feel the movement in the arms (probably due to my inattentiveness). But either way, when i feel the body movement, the first thing i do is match that body movement - and unfortunately leaving arms out at this point.

An interesting thing I find is that when I dance with people who leads with their arms (the pushing and pulling kind), I actually am able to match the force, so i guess in that regard I don't have spaghetti arms. It's just dancing with those having the proper technique/frame, i'm very much at a loss.... a very bizarre situation, no doubt!
 
lynn said:
I've had ladies putting their hands so gently on my right arm that I can barely feel their presence and on the other extreme, I've had folowers pretty much putting their entire body weight on me. I've often been told to have toned arms (not like spaghetti, of course) in order to have good connection.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if I'm understanding you but I feel like there are actually two separate topics being discussed here. I think it's important to isolate the topics at hand otherwise it's hard to compare notes. One is the amount of downward pressure from the lady's left arm applied to the man's right arm. The other is how connected the ladies arms are to her own body and how toned they are.

As for the amount of downward pressure, IMO, I would say very very little. Most ladies apply too much downward pressure. Long-time social dancers with little training often apply an excessive amount of downward pressure in an attempt to stay "connected" to their partner. Also, in general, most beginning ladies apply too much pressure as well. I feel the downward pressure should be almost nil but still with contact all along the length of the man's arm. You don't want to do the opposite by keeping the arm so lifted that there's a gap between the man's arm and the lady's.

Ask your instructor if it would be better for you, in general, to keep your left arm a little bit lighter and see what he says. I'm sort of walking into unknown waters by saying this because I don't know your dancing at all, but I feel there's about a 75% chance he'll say yes.
 
lynn said:
Hmm, let's see if i can put down on paper (or keyboard) what i'm experiencing so far: Usually when I dance with a man who has pretty good frame, he will lead a move with his body than his arm. In other words, i feel his body moving forwards/backwards earlier than i can feel the movement in the arms (probably due to my inattentiveness). But either way, when i feel the body movement, the first thing i do is match that body movement - and unfortunately leaving arms out at this point.
Click to expand...

What i have been told is once you get into close body contact, then the lead will come from his body, not so much his arms...
 
Funny enough, i haven't been experiencing this problem after i posted.... guess the problem's solved :shock: :D ??

discovery, you pretty much confirmed what i thought. i'm not sure why some guys prefer that i really "press" downard on their right arm - they feel that they're not getting enough "connection" if i don't.
 
yes, lynn I can't imagine why a lead would want you to put more downward pressure on their arm either...unless you are so light they can't even tell you are there....anytime I put pressure on my instructor's arm we either stop cold or he reminds me not to do that or he begins to groan :oops: ...and I am happy to say that the problem does seem to be going away now that we are dancing in contact more...and as I am trying to get myself out of the habit of riding along instead of supporting my own weight...the poor man
 
fascination said:
yes, lynn I can't imagine why a lead would want you to put more downward pressure on their arm either...unless you are so light they can't even tell you are there....anytime I put pressure on my instructor's arm we either stop cold or he reminds me not to do that or he begins to groan :oops: ...and I am happy to say that the problem does seem to be going away now that we are dancing in contact more...and as I am trying to get myself out of the habit of riding along instead of supporting my own weight...the poor man
Click to expand...
Yup. I actually am more then happy with the downward pressure or want less.
 
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