Close embrace

[UKDancer]

These are called ochos milonguero, or "vanilla bean ochos" by Homer.

Can anyone tell me why they are so-named (vanilla bean that is)?

 

[dchester]

I didn't use the expression "milonguero" because what I have to say applies both to close and very close embrace. An ignorant person like me is well aware of the world of dance in general. I did take lessons of that (rather) new afro-style tango dance called "kizomba". And you? What do you know about dance? You're doing well answering to people with their own words but so far you haven't shared your huge knowledge. Should I consider you're more ignorant than me?

You are free to call me ignorant when I start criticizing things that I don't know about. Right now, it's just you doing that.

 

[Lilly_of_the_valley]

Ok I agree these (milonguero) ochos are correct. If only most of people do them that way it would be great. Unfortunately that's not the case.

Not the case where? In your milonga?
What makes you assume most people on this board, for example, do them wrong?

 

[Lilly_of_the_valley]

Can anyone tell me why they are so-named (vanilla bean that is)?

Because Homer Ladas in his classes likes to invent names like such.

 

[UKDancer]

Because Homer Ladas in his classes likes to invent names like such.

Well, OK, but presumably not completely arbitrarily? It doesn't matter: I'm just curious.

 

[Shaka]

Not the case where? In your milonga?
What makes you assume most people on this board, for example, do them wrong?

In most milongas in my area and also everywhere on YouTube. Maybe am I not lucky that good milongas are not to be found on YouTube?

 

[Lilly_of_the_valley]

Well, OK, but presumably not completely arbitrarily? It doesn't matter: I'm just curious.

Unfortunately I was not present in that class, so I do not know the rationale behind that one... sorry.

 

[Temza]

Can anyone tell me why they are so-named (vanilla bean that is)?

Because the resulting figure of steps is long and slightly curvy? just a guess

 

[Lilly_of_the_valley]

In most milongas in my area and also everywhere on YouTube. Maybe am I not lucky that good milongas are not to be found on YouTube?

From the response on this board you might notice that the majority of people are aware of technical details of dancing in close embrace, and there is a reasonable hope that they at least strive to execute it right. Would not you agree?

 

[UKDancer]

Because the resulting figure of steps is long and slightly curvy? just a guess

That sounds likely. Thanks.

 

[Shaka]

From the response on this board you might notice that the majority of people are aware of technical details of dancing in close embrace, and there is a reasonable hope that they at least strive to execute it right. Would not you agree?

Well I can guess many people here are aware of the technique. Still, many misunderstandings have brought out some lacks of technique and I think it's important to debate about them.

 

[Zoopsia59]

Good try, but I'm not talking about that kind of ochos. The follower still sends back her legs straight backward. That's the diagonal movements initiated by the leader that force her to cross while her legs are still in the air. I should add that there's no need for pivot / dissociation because her pelvis is already oriented (in the diagonals) by the leader.

Those ARE traveling crossed back ochos. You basically said exactly what I said about them. She reaches straight back, but her foot is placed (by the leader) in a position diagonal to her pelvis.

So the actual path of foot travel if traced on the floor is diagonal to her pelvis.

Maybe we need to get someone to do this with paint on their shoe so it's obvious.

You'll notice also in this same video that the way Homer gets her to execute these ochos is that HE takes diagonal steps. If his steps were square to his pelvis, he would step on her.

 

[Zoopsia59]

Well I can guess many people here are aware of the technique. Still, many misunderstandings have brought out some lacks of technique and I think it's important to debate about them.

Lack of technique on whose part? Who has shown to have lack of technique based on the posts on this thread?

 

[Zoopsia59]

I didn't use the expression "milonguero" because what I have to say applies both to close and very close embrace.

Could you explain what you feel the difference is between close and very close embrace?

 

[Zoopsia59]

Here's a thought folks....

Diagonal. What is diagonal?

Stand on a floor with tiles, grain, boards, lines, whatever.
Stand with your pelvis perfectly aligned with one axis of the lines
Stand on your right foot
Reach forward with your left along the other axis of lines and place it about 18-24" directly in front of your right

Your two feet should now be on a single line that forms a 90* angle to the line that your pelvis is on.

Without changing your right foot, draw your left back so that it is on the right side of your right foot. No need to get to extreme... it can be right alongside the right foot.

The line your foot had to travel to get there is not 90* to the line your pelvis is on (if it were, it would end up on top of your right foot) Therefore it is on a diagonal. Slight.. but it's still diagonal. Depending on how far over to the right it ends up (based on the lead) it might be more of a diagonal, but it can't be less.

I'm getting the feeling that some people are defining diagonal as being greater than a certain angle off the 90* line. If so, then what angle are you calling diagonal and what counts as "straight back"?

And viewed another way... if diagonal and straight are terms in relations to the pelvis (not the line of dance) what do we do about V embrace? In that style the follower frequently travels on a line diagonal to her pelvis.

So to say one must never take diagonal steps in AT is very misleading at best. (and personally, I'd say it's just plain wrong)