(Dance) Partners: for better or worse

[iLiketoLeadwhenIdance]

I'm not abnormal - I'm ambidanceterous!

 

[Laura]

Now we're toying with the idea of competing, and wishing that we could do so reverse-role.

I used to help at some competitions the so-called "same sex" circuit in Northern California. While most couples were same sex, and switching off lead-and-follow, we also had some "reverse-role" opposite-sex couples who were competing, too. So maybe you can do it there, or maybe in a collegiate competition.

 

[meow]

You know, going back to the original idea of this thread - I know of one dancer who has had about 13 partners. It seemed like every year there was a split for one reason or another. His current partnership is working; they have been together for about 4 years. Nothing romantic just dancing.

 

[elisedance]

Nothing like trial and error, and trial and error, and trial .... to get it right eh?
Gee, if women would have such luxury.... If it moves and doesn't stamp on your feet we hang on to it (just kiddin folks.... well, mostly).

 

[WorksForShoes]

DH is my DP, and he is the one who suggested we take up dancing 3 years ago. I'm so glad he did!

One thing we were discussing yesterday is that, while having your romantic partner as your DP is wonderful, the stakes are higher for conflict resolution. There is no going home and complaining about your DP or going to the studio to blow off steam from home. Any issue you have, you take with you, so it is essential to learn how to resolve things both on and off the hardwood.

 

[delamusica]

If it moves and doesn't stamp on your feet we hang on to it (just kiddin folks.... well, mostly).

When it comes down to it, even the feet-stomping is negotiable . . .

 

[etp777]

Oh, i guess I could actually talk about my current partner too, rather than just complaining about not being able to find another amateur.

Currently dancing pro/am, so of course my partner is my teacher. Actually got randomly assigned to her by manager at studio. If I had been asked, would have asked for other teacher (and probably could have if I had wanted to), was actually planning on asking if I didn't like my pro. Started taking lessons with her though, and never looked back. Which turned out well too, as while pro I would have asked for is an amazing dancer, and a good teacher, she's too tall for me (at least 8 inches taller), and her teaching style doesn't fit me as well as current pro. Plus she just left our studio a few months back to manage Jesse's new studio. So would have ended up being reassigned to this pro anyway. But we look good on the floor height wise, and personalities mesh well, so that even in my first comp, jsut a few months in, had a better connection than i would have expected, and just gets better all the time. Obviously, not the connection I might have with an amateur partner, as I purposely keep msyelf somewhat distant from pro, since she is my teacher (and because I already hang out with all other pros in region for FA, don't need to add another studio I can't dance at). But overall, very happy with my partner, and I just hope she's still teaching when I get back in the country. I definitely wouldn't be doing as well as I do now if I had gotten one of other teachers in area, and also just wouldn't enjoy myself as much as I do with current pro. Good match, in height, dance connection, and personality. Of course, horrible match talent wise, as she's way better than me, but that's to be expected.

 

[meow]

In AM partnerships, one of the main issues can be effective communication. If that is lacking, problems can easily set in.

 

[iLiketoLeadwhenIdance]

Alas, we are well out of the collegiate category, and very far from California - we're in the DC area. I have already been reserved for some same-sex fun comps at dance camp, though . . .

 

[elisedance]

Not kidding Meow. To paraphrase the old real estage adadge - there are things crucially important in AM dancing - communication, communication and communication.

The rest is all patience!

We're developing a pretty good communication I think - I am just intrigued to find out how our partnership will be affected by the first competition. I'm fairly confident that it will make it stronger, however things turn out. But lets see. I suppose the toughest challenge to communication is whether it can survive a good drubbing!

 

[elisedance]

Oh, i guess I could actually talk about my current partner too, rather than just complaining about not being able to find another amateur.

Currently dancing pro/am, so of course my partner is my teacher. ... But we look good on the floor height wise, and personalities mesh well, so that even in my first comp, jsut a few months in, had a better connection than i would have expected, and just gets better all the time. Obviously, not the connection I might have with an amateur partner, as I purposely keep msyelf somewhat distant from pro, since she is my teacher (and because I already hang out with all other pros in region for FA, don't need to add another studio I can't dance at). But overall, very happy with my partner... Of course, horrible match talent wise, as she's way better than me, but that's to be expected.

pro/am is such an interesting bird - especially if you stay with the same teacher for long time. It does not matter how much you start off as teacher/student eventually, even if your abilities never match, it becomes a real partnership. You learn each others strengths and weaknesses, tricks and blotches - and its two way. If you look at the top level of pro/am comps often its hard to figure out who is who, pro and 'student'. Sometimes the am may actually excell the pro in aspects such as competition nerves -thats not something that favors the cool and may not be easy to learn.

Eventually I began to object to the term 'student' since it seemed derogatory to the amount of hours we had worked together and the level we were reaching. While I am not so dumb as to think I could ever match my pro's abilities it still seemed rather like teacher and 10 yr old. I asked him to refer to me as his pro/am partner - a term I found pleasant and accurate. He's such a sweety he actually did.

 

[Laura]

If you look at the top level of pro/am comps often its hard to figure out who is who, pro and 'student'.

I respectfully disagree with you on this one! Yes, sometimes it is difficult, but in Standard at least it's usually pretty obvious. I was watching the Open Pro/Am Standard at Embassy Ball and it was very clear who the teachers were because they were all the biggest names in Pro Standard in the US. Their students were very Very VERY good, but it was not difficult to tell which was the teacher and which was the student.

Eventually I began to object to the term 'student' since it seemed derogatory to the amount of hours we had worked together and the level we were reaching.

I do not find it derogatory at all. In fact, I would consider it disrespectful to my teacher's actual professional partner if I were to go around calling myself my teacher's partner, and even if I qualified it with "Pro/Am partner" it still seems like a presumption to me. I look at it like martial arts training, where people are forever students of some master, their sensei, and it's a life-long learning process. After all, everyone is a student of someone -- even teachers. I do not at all mind being the student of an excellent teacher. In fact, it's kind of an honor in itself.

Interestingly enough, my current teacher's ex-Professional partner sometimes referred to me as the "Pro/Am partner," but it was not anything I ever said. I'm guess I'm just really sensitive to sounding like I'm "presuming" any thing. Other people aren't as sensitive as I, I'm sure.

I asked him to refer to me as his pro/am partner - a term I found pleasant and accurate. He's such a sweety he actually did.

He is very sweet! There are teachers out there who would not respond so positively to this!

I guess for me that "partner" means "equal peer," which is simply not ever going to be the case so long as I am dancing with the person who is teaching me. My "hang up" I suppose!

 

[waltzgirl]

I don't think it's a hang-up, Laura. I totally agree with you! I don't think there is anything wrong and certainly not derogatory about being a student and I think it is a little presumptuous, as a hobby dancer (however serious), to require a label that implies equal standing with someone who has devoted their lives and careers to dance.

 

[elisedance]

I don't think it's a hang-up, Laura. I totally agree with you! I don't think there is anything wrong and certainly not derogatory about being a student and I think it is a little presumptuous, as a hobby dancer (however serious), to require a label that implies equal standing with someone who has devoted their lives and careers to dance.

WG and Laura.

I think you read things into my letter that were not there. I certainly did not say nor imply that I intended 'pro/am partner' as ever pretending to be equal to pro partner. The name It makes it obvious that the am is an am and the pro is a pro. Besides, there are plenty of Ams that truly have devoted their lives to dance (clearly not the case for me) and sometimes the am comps out do the pros.

 

[elisedance]

I respectfully disagree with you on this one! Yes, sometimes it is difficult, but in Standard at least it's usually pretty obvious. I was watching the Open Pro/Am Standard at Embassy Ball and it was very clear who the teachers were because they were all the biggest names in Pro Standard in the US. Their students were very Very VERY good, but it was not difficult to tell which was the teacher and which was the student.

I did say 'top levels' and I think you out topped me! You are right, of course, a super-star will always outshine a top hobbyist. But not all pros are top names and they also compete - and sometimes (it was a sometimes) they are not so easy to distinguish.

Interestingly enough, my current teacher's ex-Professional partner sometimes referred to me as the "Pro/Am partner," but it was not anything I ever said.

You must be very good indeed for his pro-partner to make that comment. Maybe you should ask her what her thinking was? Perhaps she felt like I do that to call you a student at your level did not sufficiently recognize your talent and the extent of your training. For me the unfortunately aspect of the term 'student' is that you can never actually get anywhere. Amateur couples in pre-champ or open are still learning and may be at exactly the same level as the pro-am competitor - but they are no longer called students (the term novice is, to me at least, not so bad as it does at least imply that you learned something).

=I guess for me that "partner" means "equal peer," which is simply not ever going to be the case so long as I am dancing with the person who is teaching me. My "hang up" I suppose!

We all carry our own baggage of course - obviously the word 'student' to me refers to a more junior status than it does to you (for me its a work thing) while the word 'partner' seems to have a grander implication to you than it does to me. Its the general usage that is, of course, important and perhaps on the latter the general usage for 'partner' in ballroom is more formal than I think of it. I don't know. For me a dance 'partner' is someone that you work with on a one-on-one level to achieve a common goal - as appart from a student who is someone that is talking lessons in order to dance elsewhere. For me it is particularly significant that that in open pro-am you are judged not on your own but as a couple - as, in fact, a partnership.

Perhaps that explains better why I like the term pro-am partner. It encompasses much better than pro-am student a goal of dancing as a couple in competition. But its all sematics and we should each (pro included) use the terms that we feel most comfortable with.