ymmv
Determining skill by watching
- Thread starter twnkltoz
- Start date
ymmv
opendoor
Forum Master
Ja: "...ever done a volcada?"
bordertangoman
Well-Known Member
Mmm.
I hate to break it to you, but sometimes women pretend to be having a better time than they are actually having. Ahem.
(Is there a Tango equivalent to "Lie back and think of England?" )
I think that is pretty much universal..hence the success of Facebook; its prime function is to let other people know that you are having a better time than them.....
having said that one of my class was laughing so hard last night he couldnt speak and tell me what had tickled his funny bone..
And someone who is totally focused on the dance may not be smiling because they are concentrating... so if you base your assessment of their partner on the lack of smiling on the part of the one focused and concentrating, you might miss a great partner.
I haven't mentioned smiling, and that is not what I'm talking about. It's more a look of bliss that I'm thinking about. And yes, I know, the guy she's dancing with might have something to do with it.
My point is (and has been from the beginning) that even if she isn't blissful looking, it doesn't mean she isn't dancing with a good leader (and vice versa... if a leader doesn't look blissful, it doesn't mean he is dancing with a bad follower)
And judging from the follower I mentioned above, just because someone looks blissful, doesn't mean they are a good dancer, that their partner is a good dancer, or that the partner is in bliss at all. The blissful person may just be blissfully ignorant of how much trouble their partner is having with them.
But then, what do I know.. I judge whether or not someone is good to dance with by actually dancing with them.
What a good idea! Maybe I wasn't in class the day they taught that.
A few thoughts:
1) Often <> Always (i.e. no single criteria is foolproof)
2) The face (relaxation) isn't the only thing I look at, but it's a good one.
3) When I look at the follower's face and see her look relaxed, it tells me that she's capable of being relaxed, but if I see the leader looking quite different, then I feel there's a disconnect.
4) Smiling often doesn't occur until the end of the song or tanda (although I suppose they might be smiling because they're glad it's over).
5) I'll also look to see if the leader has to chase after her (indicating she's not staying with him), typically on turns.
6) This stuff applies more to a connection type of song/tanda, as opposed to a high energy song, like Borges y Paraguay by Bajofondo Tango, where relaxation isn't a dominant feature, (the criteria I'm looking for is different).
7) BTW, none of this stuff matters, if I've danced with the follower before and remember what she dances like, or we are friends, etc. If I like dancing with her, I couldn't care less if some other leader is having problems with her.
tangobro
Active Member
I'm a male, I look for a female dancer, not to see if she is "good", but to see if she goes on my "don't ask" list. As far as I'm concerned "good" only means good with me.
I don't ask if:
- she is looking around the room, head turning, maybe waving at friends while dancing. Unless she is dancing with someone who seems to be giving her a miserable dance I assume she may be also be disengaged with me (I know it's bad to assume but this is a snap judgement).
- she picks up her feet to step, rather than extending the leg. I've noticed that women who do this seem heavy & wind up giving me back aches.
- poor posture. She either is slouched over her partner or her upper body is arched back in what I think of as ballroom style. Again - back aches.
- she is doing unlead boleos, ganchos or wraps. I've had unlead boleos pull me off balance and aggravate my knees.
If she does not do any of the above I look to see if she maintains her axis by collecting, and does not change her weight from 1 foot to the other without a lead. If those points are good then I'll want to find out if she will be "good" with me.
mshedgehog
New Member
Lots of sensible stuff above, the only thing I'd add is that, disregarding obvious red flags which have been mentioned already, I've always found visual assessment surprisingly unreliable.
I've slowly got a bit better at it, over the years, but it doesn't usually give me reliable information about how the person will feel to me. I tend to ask other women how they got on, and assess the answers in relation to my knowledge of them.
I've slowly got a bit better at it, over the years, but it doesn't usually give me reliable information about how the person will feel to me. I tend to ask other women how they got on, and assess the answers in relation to my knowledge of them.
FWIW, I do dance with beginners. It's only some tandas (songs), where I might get more selective.
After all, people danced with me when I was a beginner and absolutely sucked, so now that I've progressed all the way to mediocre, I'm not about to become a tango snob.
After all, people danced with me when I was a beginner and absolutely sucked, so now that I've progressed all the way to mediocre, I'm not about to become a tango snob.
Lilly_of_the_valley
Well-Known Member
Not dancing with beginners is not always about snobbery. There are beginners, and then there are perpetual beginners, beginners who are not learning the right things, beginners with bad attitude, beginners whose behavior is dangerous, rude, disrespectful. Patience and generosity of others, as grand as they might be, is not the bottomless pit.
There are also beginners who are learning a style I don't prefer. I am happy to dance with beginners who show potential in the style that I enjoy. After all, if they become proficient at it, I get another partner.
Agree. Beginners are usually not as much trouble as "intermediate" or "advanced" dancers can be.
twnkltoz
Forum Master
Very true. There's a saying amongst WCS dancers that applies to AT and BR, too:
Beginners do basics. Intermediate dancers do moves. Advanced dancers do basics...really well.