Fast Tango or Milonga

Steve Pastor said:
You might want to look through the sheet music available... [/URL]

Hi Steve,
I really got no answer to this question, because a lot of old tangos I really supposed to be written in 4/4 are actually in 2/4. But, very often the melody goes over two bars in these peaces, while in true milongas almost every second note is stress throughout the peace.
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Sure, I get what you're saying. Darn musicians sacrifice simplicity to make it interesting.
I like pretty much like simple rules.
Thank goodness we can just dance to what we hear.
 
As I was dancing this past weekend, I realized something about the way I hear tango music. (And, well, other music that I like dancing AT to.) I don't "hear" the beats when I dance. I'm sure it filters through somewhere along the line, but I don't hear them the way I hear beats if I'm dancing ballroom or something else.

I hear plenty of other things, though...the rhythm, the melody, the phrasing, the build & release of tension...all kinds of things. I'd have to consciously stop and listen to the music in order to figure out what beat I was dancing to at any given time. Odd...
 
Not odd...excellent. You should dance BR the same way. There is so much more to be found/gained from BR than 99.8% of the persons doing it will ever know because they do not dance it this way. The reason why you don't is simply because you were taught to not by tradition. You are one of the fortunate few who has the ability and the desire to be better than tradition. Go for it.
 
Oh, hell. In ballroom I don't hear the music at all. I hear beats before I start, and maybe for the first measure or so, but after that I stop listening to it.
 
Peaches said:
As I was dancing this past weekend, I realized something about the way I hear tango music. (And, well, other music that I like dancing AT to.) I don't "hear" the beats when I dance. I'm sure it filters through somewhere along the line, but I don't hear them the way I hear beats if I'm dancing ballroom or something else.

I hear plenty of other things, though...the rhythm, the melody, the phrasing, the build & release of tension...all kinds of things. I'd have to consciously stop and listen to the music in order to figure out what beat I was dancing to at any given time. Odd...
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This is interesting, as a friend of mine said she didn't like the alternative non-tango music if it had an eastern flavour as she said this didn't have 'resolution' :she didn't know where to breath as she couldn't discern the phrasing.

She had no problem with following me but didn't understand what i was working with in what I was taking out of the music. Similarly my music teacher thought it would be helpful for me to clap out crotchets and quavers and I told him politely no it was a waste of time. (and as about as useful as learning to ride bike, musically speaking) Korey did this exercise to nod to your partner to get an extra clap but I couldn't do it. I can understanding clapping a rhythm but how can you clap a note that lasts 2 or three beats- it didn't make any sense. A clap is a staccato sound.

So maybe you are doing what I do which is working on very intuitive level (rather than analytical) Sometimes I try to figure out what I do but it changes as soon as I start thinking about it.

When it comes to teaching musicality I really have to simplify things since I think we all hear something different in the music( or as a tango friend commented, perhaps nothing at all.)
She gets off on jolly little tangos I get inspired by minor keys. In fact I would go so far as to say that shift from a minor to major key in the middle of a song actually feels unpleasant.
 
bordertangoman said:
This is interesting, as a friend of mine said she didn't like the alternative non-tango music if it had an eastern flavour as she said this didn't have 'resolution' :she didn't know where to breath as she couldn't discern the phrasing.

She had no problem with following me but didn't understand what i was working with in what I was taking out of the music. Similarly my music teacher thought it would be helpful for me to clap out crotchets and quavers and I told him politely no it was a waste of time. (and as about as useful as learning to ride bike, musically speaking) Korey did this exercise to nod to your partner to get an extra clap but I couldn't do it. I can understanding clapping a rhythm but how can you clap a note that lasts 2 or three beats- it didn't make any sense. A clap is a staccato sound.

So maybe you are doing what I do which is working on very intuitive level (rather than analytical) Sometimes I try to figure out what I do but it changes as soon as I start thinking about it.

When it comes to teaching musicality I really have to simplify things since I think we all hear something different in the music( or as a tango friend commented, perhaps nothing at all.)
She gets off on jolly little tangos I get inspired by minor keys. In fact I would go so far as to say that shift from a minor to major key in the middle of a song actually feels unpleasant.
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See, and the clapping thing makes perfect sense to me--doesn't phase me in the least. And I feel I'm very lucky to have been taught how to listen to music by my mother. (Thank you, Mom, yet again. From the bottom of my heart.) I can go both the intuitive route and the analytical route, I believe, although my ear isn't as well trained to the analytical side as I'd ideally like.

Also, WRT the shift from major to minor and feeling unpleasant...I'd say that's a good use of music. Things in major tend to sound and feel "happier" (very broad and imprecise use of the word, here); things in minor tend to feel more unhappy and brooding. If you're feeling a shift like that, I'd say that's the point...to induce a change of emotion.
 
Peaches said:
See, and the clapping thing makes perfect sense to me--doesn't phase me in the least. And I feel I'm very lucky to have been taught how to listen to music by my mother. (Thank you, Mom, yet again. From the bottom of my heart.) I can go both the intuitive route and the analytical route, I believe, although my ear isn't as well trained to the analytical side as I'd ideally like.

Also, WRT the shift from major to minor and feeling unpleasant...I'd say that's a good use of music. Things in major tend to sound and feel "happier" (very broad and imprecise use of the word, here); things in minor tend to feel more unhappy and brooding. If you're feeling a shift like that, I'd say that's the point...to induce a change of emotion.
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you misread what I wrote "minor to major" not the other way.

As a specialist in au contraire I find myself drawn to minor keys in my music lessons.
as to the minor to major change in music for me its not uplifting rather the reverse- a sense of being let down.

i personally don't recall anyone teaching me to listen to music and the school music teacher and i despised each other. (but he was probably another major key fanatic)
 
Oh. My bad re: the major/minor shift direction. But, yeah, I guess it would fit that if you're drawn to minor keys and feel happier with them, the shift could be jarring.

I think the point still stands, though--that a key change can and should be used to indicate a shift in mood. Beyond that...well, you're just special. ;-)
 
Peaches said:
Oh. My bad re: the major/minor shift direction. But, yeah, I guess it would fit that if you're drawn to minor keys and feel happier with them, the shift could be jarring.

I think the point still stands, though--that a key change can and should be used to indicate a shift in mood. Beyond that...well, you're just special. ;-)
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as in "special needs?"
 
Peaches said:
Ha!

I love Libertango, because of how interesting it is. Especially for the whole tango v. milonga debate.

Personally, I hear it as a normal-speed tango...with a lot of filigree.
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Me too - I hear it as a normal speed tango with the most prominent filigree being a continuous 3-3-2, which is very like milonga but not quite. A very exciting, driving, uneven rhythm.
 
mshedgehog said:
Me too - I hear it as a normal speed tango with the most prominent filigree being a continuous 3-3-2, which is very like milonga but not quite. A very exciting, driving, uneven rhythm.
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Yah, the tango musicians I've talked to have said 3-3-2 is a tango rhythm.
 
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