Question to pro-am dancers

tanya_the_dancer said:
He says I move differently now. I don't want to discuss this with him anymore, though, because these conversations turn into "this is all your fault" arguments. I was just surprised by this effect, though, because I thought getting better at dancing will make it easier for anyone to dance with me. Apparently not.
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Seems like you are in a tough spot. I can understand why you might not wish to discuss it. Yet if you can find a delicate way to approach the topic perhaps something good of it can happen. Unfortunately "your fault" statements can hurt, and are not productive in resolving the issue.

Hmmm ... I suspect you aren't taking lessons from the same dance teacher, but maybe you could have a confidnetial conversation with the teacher you are taking joint lessons? Perhaps that teacher can help by at least being aware of the issue and maybe the teacher can help through how the joint lessons are taught?

Best of luck with your situation! :friend:
 
PureAbsurd said:
I can confirm that things like that are possible.
I know one girl who was really fun to dance with some time ago. Both of us had only a minimal amount of instruction in swing or lindy, and both of us had a background in different other dances, and she was a really light follow. Now, after she took some lindy classes, things changed noticeably. It feels like she is expecting me to lead some moves in a very certain way and because of this tension it's harder to relax and just dance.
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Perhaps you can offer to take a joint lesson or a few with her and work on the issues with an instructor? Maybe that could help. :)
 
tanya_the_dancer said:
I have a feeling that this is what my husband would like to do. That we dance only with each other and try to stay as equal as possible. I have a huge problem with this because I would like to advance as far as I can and I know I will not be able to with this setup. And so far I have refused to do so.
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Does he want to dance am/am with you?

One of our problems we've always had since we started dancing together is that our mistakes tend to magnify each other's problems. You know sometimes one person will make a mistake and another person will make a different mistake, but they will somehow cancel out. In our case it has always been that my mistakes would make his problems worse and vice versa. And of course this always leads to "this is all your fault" arguments.
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Yes, this is the way of dance, and yet if the two people realize that sometimes mistakes just happen and forgive eachother, then time can be focused on having a good partnership.

No offense, but it always bothers me when I see couples fighting rather then communicating effectively by listening and speaking in respectful tones. If two people can try to learn from one another, and try to be understandign of one another, neat things can happen.

There really isn't an easy solution to such situations and I hope you can find a way to work this out. :cool:
 
tanya_the_dancer said:
I dunno. See, he wants dancing to be all about us, something we do as a married couple. I never saw it this way, at least I did not see it as our effort as a couple. It was more about me and how can I get better and what can I achieve.
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Yes, it seems you have identified a key issue. The expectations of what dance is going to be are different which will certainly lead to conflicts.

Finding a way for both of you to get out of it what you both want, finding a way to compromise, could be the key to finding a resolution. This can only happen through fair communication, and it might be possible with a bit of mediation. ;)
 
You said basically you want to get as good as you can get. Does it have to be now at all costs? My husband likes for me to do sports with him. But I am so much worse at anything involving a ball or running or well, a ball that I get frustrated. I can't even go bowling without getting frustrated, because even if I take a million lessons, his natural athleticism is going to keep him a step ahead of me. And that's just plain frustrating. And makes me want to quit, because what's the point of working at it if I will always be awful (and in comparison, I always am.) If we start something together, like we did with tennis, then I'm at least not always so deep in his shadow that I can have some fun without feeling like he's in the Major Leagues and I'm playing T-Ball (which is exactly what softball feels like for us.) But as soon as he started playing a lot of tennis without me, that killed it. I don't want to play tennis anymore with him. I have enough of a handicap without his adding in extra practice. So now tennis is his thing, instead of an our thing. And I'm disappointed. And if I had really wanted tennis to be an "our thing" as much as dance is an "our thing" then it probably would be an issue in our relationship. Yes, I'd be being a little bit selfish in trying to hold him back from excelling. But my perspective is he was being selfish by purposefully getting way better than me.
Perhaps if you make the sacrifice now of slowing down a bit so you can do this together (as he seems to want to do), he might lose the frustration of being the "lesser" partner and want to excel. And you can still achieve your highest level (just a little slower) without sacrificing your relationship.
You wouldn't necessarily be giving anything up, just slowing it down. A sacrifice, yes. But I'd give up a lot of things for the sake of my husband. As he would for me. (If I asked him to, he'd even slow down on the tennis so I could take some lessons and try to catch up. But tennis lessons would cut into dance lesson money so I told him never mind.)
 
Okay, Tanya...(just for you there alemana)...I can't speak to your marriage or your experience...but I am a pro/am dancer who dances MUCH more than my husband, but who originally began dancing so that he and I could look decent at social functions.

My first observation is that once I started getting a little good, even though I like to think I was delicate about it, I would get frustrated with his lead/frame or lack thereof...he wouldn't understand why I didn't get something and I became more and more certain that it wasn't my problem...again, trying to be gracious but not really succeeding...

Also I think a part of my learning curve was that as a very aggressive overachiever and as someone who liked how good it was starting to get with my pro, I began "helping" my husband to get better...and as someone who was dancing mostly routines on my lesson time...wherein lead and follow wasn't my primary focus, especially with the pro at the beginning....when I would go back and dance with dh, I continued to focus very little on following. I tended, rather, to focus on things I was working on in my lesson like, MY posture and MY lowering and MY foot pressure and MY balance and the position of MYy head etc...which wasnt a problem in a lesson because anyone can feel my pro's lead and he certainly knows where he's going as well...so consequently with a bit more confidence and knowlege and a lttle less focus on lead and follow as well as becoming more acclimated to my pro than my dh... dancing as a married couple began to be disappointing and not fun for either of us in the way that it once was when neither of us knew a thing.

I think is is understandable for someone to miss that, to want that back. It's sad that we dont know we are going to lose that when we embark upon the road to progress. Still I don't think it has to be a permanent loss, but like all growth we will have to devote more time to dancing as a couple, near to the same amount of time to it as we do to our pro/am dancing or at least as much as possible, or we will have to discuss the loss and find ways that we can dance that will be less frustrating (like just doing set choreography for a while or agreeing on some basic moves to avoid confusion or talking about which scenarios cause the most trouble...and I would reccommend that you do this when you are not dancing and have no intention of dancing...dh and I have chosen saturday mornings as times when we are both rested and can get together over a cup of coffee and discuss stuff while we are not upset over it...in attempts to understand each other better, problem solve...etc ...when everyone is well rested and no one feels threatened...I find it very useful...and lastly, I would make sure that you also do other stuff that is non-dance related before going to dance toether that puts you in a confident state of mind about your relationship before going off to dance...we all get nervous about potential stress and sometimes we can sabotage our efforts before we even start...I like dinner and conversation before dancing and good sex afterward;) ...just to sort of make the point that while we have room to grow in some areas, we are still very very good in others:cool: and that might be just the sort of reassurance that he is after....

dunno, hope some of this helps...pm if you wanna get specific...hug
 
wooh said:
You said basically you want to get as good as you can get. Does it have to be now at all costs? My husband likes for me to do sports with him. But I am so much worse at anything involving a ball or running or well, a ball that I get frustrated. I can't even go bowling without getting frustrated, because even if I take a million lessons, his natural athleticism is going to keep him a step ahead of me. And that's just plain frustrating. And makes me want to quit, because what's the point of working at it if I will always be awful (and in comparison, I always am.) If we start something together, like we did with tennis, then I'm at least not always so deep in his shadow that I can have some fun without feeling like he's in the Major Leagues and I'm playing T-Ball (which is exactly what softball feels like for us.) But as soon as he started playing a lot of tennis without me, that killed it. I don't want to play tennis anymore with him. I have enough of a handicap without his adding in extra practice. So now tennis is his thing, instead of an our thing. And I'm disappointed. And if I had really wanted tennis to be an "our thing" as much as dance is an "our thing" then it probably would be an issue in our relationship. Yes, I'd be being a little bit selfish in trying to hold him back from excelling. But my perspective is he was being selfish by purposefully getting way better than me.
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Sometimes we guys are just too darn competive. We sometimes forget that the gals in our life aren't always such and that sometimes it is better to co-operate then compete. Now, in fairness, a gal doesn't need to feel as if they must compete, yet instead set one's own goals and feel good about accomplishing those. Hopefully the guys can be supportive in this and then everyone can be much more joyful! :D

Perhaps if you make the sacrifice now of slowing down a bit so you can do this together (as he seems to want to do), he might lose the frustration of being the "lesser" partner and want to excel. And you can still achieve your highest level (just a little slower) without sacrificing your relationship.
You wouldn't necessarily be giving anything up, just slowing it down. A sacrifice, yes. But I'd give up a lot of things for the sake of my husband. As he would for me. (If I asked him to, he'd even slow down on the tennis so I could take some lessons and try to catch up. But tennis lessons would cut into dance lesson money so I told him never mind.)
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And interesting idea, as long as two people can have a constructive conversation about how to resolve their situation, then these types of compromises could be possible. :cool:

(Hmmm ... not sure I'd want to cut back on dance lessons for tennis lessons either ... ;) :lol: )
 
fascination said:
My first observation is that once I started getting a little good, even though I like to think I was delicate about it, I would get frustrated with his lead/frame or lack thereof...he wouldn't understand why I didn't get something and I became more and more certain that it wasn't my problem...again, trying to be gracious but not really succeeding...

Also I think a part of my learning curve was that as a very aggressive overachiever and as someone who liked how good it was starting to get with my pro, I began "helping" my husband to get better...and as someone who was dancing mostly routines on my lesson time...wherein lead and follow wasn't my primary focus, especially with the pro at the beginning....when I would go back and dance with dh, I continued to focus very little on following. I tended, rather, to focus on things I was working on in my lesson like, MY posture and MY lowering and MY foot pressure and MY balance and the position of MY head etc...which wasn't a problem in a lesson because anyone can feel my pro's lead and he certainly knows where he's going as well...so consequently with a bit more confidence and knowlege and a little less focus on lead and follow as well as becoming more acclimated to my pro than my dh... dancing as a married couple began to be disappointing and not fun for either of us in the way that it once was when neither of us knew a thing.
Click to expand...
Another interesting perspective. So in essence, although things can start out for the same reasons, they can change, and then there becomes more than one goal which usually requires different ways to accomplish them. :cool:

I think it is understandable for someone to miss that, to want that back. It's sad that we dont know we are going to lose that when we embark upon the road to progress. Still I don't think it has to be a permanent loss, but like all growth we will have to devote more time to dancing as a couple, near to the same amount of time to it as we do to our pro/am dancing or at least as much as possible, or we will have to discuss the loss and find ways that we can dance that will be less frustrating ...
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Ayuh, if we can recognize change, then we can adapt! :D

... (like just doing set choreography for a while or agreeing on some basic moves to avoid confusion or talking about which scenarios cause the most trouble...and I would reccommend that you do this when you are not dancing and have no intention of dancing...dh and I have chosen saturday mornings as times when we are both rested and can get together over a cup of coffee and discuss stuff while we are not upset over it...in attempts to understand each other better, problem solve...etc ...when everyone is well rested and no one feels threatened...I find it very useful...and lastly, I would make sure that you also do other stuff that is non-dance related before going to dance toether that puts you in a confident state of mind about your relationship before going off to dance...we all get nervous about potential stress and sometimes we can sabotage our efforts before we even start...I like dinner and conversation before dancing and good sex afterward;) ...just to sort of make the point that while we have room to grow in some areas, we are still very very good in others:cool: and that might be just the sort of reassurance that he is after....
Click to expand...
Great ideas!
 
fascination said:
:tongue: not likely
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heh. but seriously, you kept them to a minimum in that long post and it was FAR more readable as a result. as in, i actually read it, which is.... new.

so thanks.
 
DancePoet said:
Does he want to dance am/am with you?


Yes, this is the way of dance, and yet if the two people realize that sometimes mistakes just happen and forgive eachother, then time can be focused on having a good partnership.

No offense, but it always bothers me when I see couples fighting rather then communicating effectively by listening and speaking in respectful tones. If two people can try to learn from one another, and try to be understandign of one another, neat things can happen.

There really isn't an easy solution to such situations and I hope you can find a way to work this out. :cool:
Click to expand...

We tried am/am last year, it did not work out so well (and not just from dancing perspective).
 
tanya_the_dancer said:
We tried am/am last year, it did not work out so well (and not just from dancing perspective).
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I'm sure. And it's what is not working out so well from the non-dancing perspective that could be at the heart of the the dance issue. :( :friend:
 
wooh said:
You said basically you want to get as good as you can get. Does it have to be now at all costs? My husband likes for me to do sports with him. But I am so much worse at anything involving a ball or running or well, a ball that I get frustrated. I can't even go bowling without getting frustrated, because even if I take a million lessons, his natural athleticism is going to keep him a step ahead of me. And that's just plain frustrating. And makes me want to quit, because what's the point of working at it if I will always be awful (and in comparison, I always am.) If we start something together, like we did with tennis, then I'm at least not always so deep in his shadow that I can have some fun without feeling like he's in the Major Leagues and I'm playing T-Ball (which is exactly what softball feels like for us.) But as soon as he started playing a lot of tennis without me, that killed it. I don't want to play tennis anymore with him. I have enough of a handicap without his adding in extra practice. So now tennis is his thing, instead of an our thing. And I'm disappointed. And if I had really wanted tennis to be an "our thing" as much as dance is an "our thing" then it probably would be an issue in our relationship. Yes, I'd be being a little bit selfish in trying to hold him back from excelling. But my perspective is he was being selfish by purposefully getting way better than me.
Perhaps if you make the sacrifice now of slowing down a bit so you can do this together (as he seems to want to do), he might lose the frustration of being the "lesser" partner and want to excel. And you can still achieve your highest level (just a little slower) without sacrificing your relationship.
You wouldn't necessarily be giving anything up, just slowing it down. A sacrifice, yes. But I'd give up a lot of things for the sake of my husband. As he would for me. (If I asked him to, he'd even slow down on the tennis so I could take some lessons and try to catch up. But tennis lessons would cut into dance lesson money so I told him never mind.)
Click to expand...

This is an interesting perspective. When we started dancing at first, years ago, I was the one who knew nothing about and he has had group lessons on and off before we met, so he knew quite a few steps but little technique, everything that went wrong was my fault, and if I were not making stupid mistakes everything would be perfect, so he said. I tried to improve my dancing by taking extra lessons, or rather, by not cancelling them when he was travelling and just doing them alone. It turned out that even though it is extremely hard for me to find the beat in the music (which is something he can easily do), in all other aspects my body is better at learning how to move, so eventually we ended up where we are now.
 
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