At the end of the pandemic, maybe a new start?

[JournalInTime]

I think meditative tango is more suited to slow contemporary music rather than traditional, to be honest.

That depends on your neurotype. Some people need to immerse themselves in fast physical movement that demands total focus in order to meditate (Sufi whirling is an example). I find the control needed to express the fastest D'Arienzo tangos down to the individual note demands such focus that it's meditative – I can achieve it only with total abandonment of self and mindfulness to the music. Whereas slow contemporary music cannot occupy enough clock cycles in my brain for me to even find it interesting.

 

[LadyLeader]

If anything, it seems to be a younger, single, group moving in to have fun and replace us 'oldies' as we shuffle along life's pathway. Evolution! But maybe it will be rediscovered as they age.

But again at that time they will be old an shuffling around!

 

[Rabbit]

That depends on your neurotype. Some people need to immerse themselves in fast physical movement that demands total focus in order to meditate (Sufi whirling is an example). I find the control needed to express the fastest D'Arienzo tangos down to the individual note demands such focus that it's meditative – I can achieve it only with total abandonment of self and mindfulness to the music. Whereas slow contemporary music cannot occupy enough clock cycles in my brain for me to even find it interesting.

I guess meditation probably has as many definitional issues as that other word people are complaining about in the other thread

 

[itwillhappen]

I... am confused. Is this from a milonga/event organizer, some prominent figure in a tango community? Is the """milonguero""" style that incompatible with other """styles""", or is that the events they organised had rules against other styles?? What?

Perhaps a bit of context (while maintaining privacy, naturally) would be helpful in explaining more.

Well, the organizer has been running a weekend event and a regional milonga, but hasn't really regained momentum after the pandemic. And "milonguero/close embrace" can't be enforced at a regular milonga anyway, and it wasn't either.

The thing I notice here is that I (59) don't really want to move much further "forward".

 

[itwillhappen]

I guess meditation probably has as many definitional issues as that other word people are complaining about in the other thread

If we mean "trance", then I can reach that quite well with Calo/Podesta or Pugliese/Maciel etc. In fact, the last quarter of my DJ sets consists of pieces like these.

 

[itwillhappen]

Didn't you know that most die-hard conservatives and backward looking stylists only for economic and strategic reasons advocate their style.

And which groups exactly do you suspect of behaving fundamentally differently?

 

[JournalInTime]

I guess meditation probably has as many definitional issues as that other word people are complaining about in the other thread

Famously so. I for one favor "moving meditation," and find that for me, the necessary movements are rapid. The closer you are to being a proponent of stationary meditation, I suppose the slower the movements – if any – you would want. The idea that rapid physical movement can entrain meditative brain-wave states isn't really in question, though (I'll see if I can't find the study on martial arts I read in the 1990s); it's the differences between brains that are difficult to nail down.

 

[Brummbaer]

But again at that time they will be old an shuffling around!

Age doesn't necessarily define the dance, or the caminata. You don't 'shuffle' in dancing because of age, but because you quit dancing.

I might want to shuffle along life's pathways to get to the end slower.

 

[opendoor]

And which group.. do you suspect of behaving ..differently?

Actually none. But that isn't my point, itwillhappen. I hate the normative arrogance and obtrusive morality in which some German-speaking tango teachers established their style. Once you danced big, it was reprehensible, everyone on the dance floor looked at you in disgust. Said group of teachers has poisoned the liberal and relaxed climate of our milongas. Of course, this suited many dancers, since boredom and mediocrity were raised to the norm. But this group is dying out, so the protagonists have quickly chosen a new target group! Most important, its younger.

 

[opendoor]

On this we seem to have different opinions!

What makes you think that?

..appreciate ..variation ...my tangosalon is on the rise.. like to maintain my ...milonguero ..tangonuevo.. active part of my vocabulary..

I ranted against milonguero teachers, but never against the style! I also dance many styles. I have propagated this here in countless posts. However, I don't change the styles arbitrarily, because for me they are associated with certain periods, orchestras, barrios, and locations.

On this we seem to have different opinions!

Again, what makes you think like that?

 

[pianistamediano]

Well, the organizer has been running a weekend event and a regional milonga, but hasn't really regained momentum after the pandemic. And "milonguero/close embrace" can't be enforced at a regular milonga anyway, and it wasn't either.

The thing I notice here is that I (59) don't really want to move much further "forward".

Thanks for the clarification. It's just very confusing, the way the organiser phrased it:

The main features of Milonguero events, such as a very good Dj's, very good dance floor and sound system, respectful interaction on and off the dance floor, will be maintained...

Aren't those just what a good (tango) event should be? And why on earth would they even prohibit or indirectly discourage styles that aren't their definition of "milonguero" before?

 

[pianistamediano]

Famously so. I for one favor "moving meditation," and find that for me, the necessary movements are rapid. The closer you are to being a proponent of stationary meditation, I suppose the slower the movements – if any – you would want. The idea that rapid physical movement can entrain meditative brain-wave states isn't really in question, though (I'll see if I can't find the study on martial arts I read in the 1990s); it's the differences between brains that are difficult to nail down.

I personally practise walking meditation (經行), which I find is a very nice exercise in stillness in motion and mindfulness, while also being a lovely medium between stationary and moving (rapidly) meditation.

 

[itwillhappen]

Aren't those just what a good (tango) event should be?

No, it is a question of costs, of business model, of resource allocation. So what is attractive enough for a weekend event with travel and accomodation? A festival with live music, star teachers and performances - or are good dancers, a good floor and good sound enough?

And why on earth would they even prohibit or indirectly discourage styles that aren't their definition of "milonguero" before?

Why are there different styles of walking meditation (zen kinhin) in terms of walking direction, speed, elbow, hand and finger position? And why is there usually no meditation together with other styles?

 

[pianistamediano]

Why are there different styles of walking meditation (zen kinhin) in terms of walking direction, speed, elbow, hand and finger position? And why is there usually no meditation together with other styles?

Tradition, practicality [?], purpose, tendency of the people from where one style originates, take your pick: I just chose what felt most natural for myself.

In my own experience, back home in Asia, while they can teach differing styles of meditation at different monasteries in different countries, they do not really discourage or prohibit any style, only making statements about how one style or another might be more suited, or encourage an aspect, or have some symbolic value (just pulling examples out of the air, since it has been years). People just tend to follow what they say or demonstrate.

If you become too concerned with minutiae, then it becomes disruptive. You simply take a step, and another, and another.

 

[Brummbaer]

And why on earth would they even prohibit or indirectly discourage styles that aren't their definition of "milonguero" before?

I don't agree with that idea, but possibilities: closeness and Covid-19, women feeling they need to guard against some men, some 'correctness' about touching, being in close proximity, partner trust...

I do observe that more women seem to want open hold unless it's someone they feel can trusted. It's taking time to rebuild social relationships, and I do see more younger, single, women at a bigger milonga. Possibly others have a different experience, but I'll go with whatever their reasons are. 'Tradition' is going as alternatives are explored.