Get Outta There!!

[itwillhappen]

It has nothing to do with steps for me. Women just gravitate to the armpit before I even step.

For me, this is the time to negotiate the common framework. If I notice that she emphasizes one side more, then I also go against it on that side. Could it be that you avoid this confrontation because of pain experiences?

Actually, I would not need to start dancing if that fails, regardless of whether it's caused by different preferences or a lack of skills. But I'm not like that after all, so I dutifully dance the one tanda.

And if I really want to assert myself, I can also enter in crossed system on the right and give a few sacadas to the outside while walking forward. I want to see the follower then still sticking to my right side.

 

[ArbeeNYC]

Women just gravitate to the armpit before I even step.

Hmm. I'm not sure. If you wrap your arm around her back, your own armpit is pretty darn close to the side of her body. That's normal.

 

[tangomaniac]

Hmm. I'm not sure. If you wrap your arm around her back, your own armpit is pretty darn close to the side of her body. That's normal.

I want us to align sternum-to-sternum. She won't be in my armpit if the alignment is right. I wrap my arm around her lower back. There's no reason for her to be in my armpit.

 

[ArbeeNYC]

I want us to align sternum-to-sternum. She won't be in my armpit if the alignment is right. I wrap my arm around her lower back. There's no reason for her to be in my armpit.

Depends on the size of the woman and the length of your arms. I'm not that tall and can't even get my arm around the back of some women. So, if she's propertionally wider or thicker, she'll end up closer to your right armpit even if you are sternum-to-sternum. I mean, she's not actually wedged into my armpit, but she's close to that upper part of my arm. And I put my arm more in the center of the follower's back.

 

[Tango Distance]

Note how effectively President Obama dealt with this issue. He pulls her right arm straight attempting to pull her free from his armpit. That fails, so he does a sudden reversal of direction while simultaneously flipping the V embrace to the other side. He then masterfully gets her into open embrace, and has 100% clear armpits the rest of the dance.

 

[opendoor]

..want us to align sternum-to-sternum.. There's no reason for her to be in my armpit...

But sternum to sternum is not automatically the generic tango embrace, seen worldwide. As described above, you should agree on the style before the first dance. There are two possibilities.
You can make it dependent on the music. Traditionally, di Sarli and Pugliese are danced in V-hold (tango de salón), d'Darienzo and Biagi are danced sternum to sternum.

But you can also display it in advance. If you stretch out your left arm when embracing, it will indicate parallel hold. If your right hand is faster, it means V-hold.

 

[Tangogal]

I’ve found that leaders who place their right arm completely across the follower’s back tend to pull slightly to their right during the dance. Perhaps not crossing the mid-line of the follower’s back could be a solution? This is not my own idea it was taught in a workshop by Sebastian Arce and Marianna Montes many years ago.

 

[Mr. Moustachio]

If far more than half of followers (say, 7-10 out of 10) do that thing, it's probably the leader.

Well, if it's 7 out of 10, just dance with the 3 you like. Problem solved. If it's 10 out of 10, it's the teachers' fault for not teaching the correct technique.

It could be, but the clue is in leader - they're meant to lead and not walk storm past. It could also be that they're not dancing with you - as in their chest is facing straight ahead whilst having turned the follower slightly away causing them to slip past.

Agreed. I find that a lot of people don't dissociate. If we're talking about step 3 of the 8-count basic, the man should turn his shoulders/torso slightly to the right/clockwise so that his chest faces his partner and the woman should turn her shoulders/torso slightly to the right/clockwise so that her chest faces her partner.

If followers and leaders simply refused to dance with people with those bad habits, said habits would fade away.

Or people will complain about snobs and cliques.

 

[opendoor]

..right arm completely across the follower’s back tend to pull..

On the other hand, they actually teach and favor this hold. They call it "deep embrace".

....workshop ..many years ago..

I had several workshops and privates with Sebastián and Marianna in 2010 and 2011. Maybe we saw each other?

 

[ArbeeNYC]

Traditionally, di Sarli and Pugliese are danced in V-hold (tango de salón), d'Darienzo and Biagi are danced sternum to sternum.

This diktat is found where?

 

[ArbeeNYC]

I’ve found that leaders who place their right arm completely across the follower’s back tend to pull slightly to their right during the dance. Perhaps not crossing the mid-line of the follower’s back could be a solution? This is not my own idea it was taught in a workshop by Sebastian Arce and Marianna Montes many years ago.

Depends on the follower as much as the leader. Some do, some don't. As for Arce and Montes, they're performers. Lots of technical chops but performers nonetheless.

 

[Steve Pastor]

Currently Reviewing a very well done dance book from the early 50s.... I'll go with what the author had to say. There is no one size fits all place for the man's hand on the woman's back. There are too many sizes and shapes where dance partners are concerned. The very few woman who reached around their back to move my hand to another position were never asked to dance (again if it hadn't happened in a class) by yours truly.

 

[Tangogal]

Depends on the follower as much as the leader. Some do, some don't. As for Arce and Montes, they're performers. Lots of technical chops but performers nonetheless.

Maybe it didn’t come across in the written word. I wasn’t blaming all leaders or suggesting that it’s not also a follower problem. I was offering a solution based on my experience. I’m short so my nose is actually in the leader’s armpit if I don’t actively try to stay in a central position. Fingertips in my ribs are not terribly comfortable either. I also have some discomfort in my shoulders so don’t like to dance with my arms above my head so the “up and over” followers arm over leaders shoulder is not a preference.

As to Sebastian Arce and Mariana Montes. I wouldn’t judge their teachings by their performances. I highly recommend their classes if you get a chance to attend.

@opendoor I haven’t had an opportunity to dance in Germany so we probably attended similar workshops in different locales. I didn’t have much money so only travelled once or twice a year for dance.

 

[opendoor]

...This diktat is found where?

Presumably, people love your directness and non-conformity. My niche is more aesthetics. You could also call me a softie. The wine has to match the dish and the color of the tie has to match the suit and shirt. Therefore, it is not a norm, Arbee, its rather a serving suggestion.

 

[opendoor]

...haven’t had an opportunity to dance in Germany..

I had my privates with them in Sitges and Rome. The dates in Germany didn't suit me, so I followed Sebastián and Marianna to different festivals.