Miles apart embrace

[itwillhappen]

This couple will never dance well together because they have no embrace. They are focused on their feet. They are learning steps from the instructor that are no part of the social tango scene in Buenos Aires. They are obviously husband and wife trying to improve their dancing, but the instructor isn't giving them what they need. Sad.

Just to mention that - the instructor claims on his homepage that he was born in Argentina, has been intimately involved with Tango all his life - is a very experienced Argentine Tango dancer, choreographer and milonguero.

 

[Mladenac]

Oh, how I missed bashing on others to promote oneself.

I witnessed many situations when people come to private/group classes without proper skill/experience.
Sometimes is bad to put your performance/demo online but it is better something dancing nothing.
What I can see that the teacher in the private class video knows how to dance and is smooth.
Since it is a demo only we don't know what he was teaching during the class.

 

[opendoor]

This couple will never dance well together because they have no embrace. They are focused on their feet. They are learning steps from the instructor that are no part of the social tango scene in Buenos Aires. They are obviously husband and wife trying to improve their dancing, but the instructor isn't giving them what they need. Sad.

Just to mention that the instructor claims on his homepage that he was born in Argentina, has been intimately involved with Tango all his life, is a very experienced Argentine Tango dancer, choreographer and milonguero.

I´ve met so many argentines in my life that learned tango in my hometown Hamburg (Germany). They all claim on their homepage to have cut their teeth into Tango, to be deeply involved with the Tango all their life and so forth..

 

[Vincenze]

A good dancer dynamically changes his embrace. Some steps require the close embrace, some open.

In this video Jorge Torres starts with the close embrace and switches to the open one for the ochos.

 

[jantango]

Just to mention that - the instructor claims on his homepage that he was born in Argentina, has been intimately involved with Tango all his life - is a very experienced Argentine Tango dancer, choreographer and milonguero.

They say whatever sounds good on the internet but it's not always true. He is not a milonguero; the fact he is a choreographer confirms it. Milongueros improvise in the moment.

A good dancer dynamically changes his embrace. Some steps require the close embrace, some open.
In this video Jorge Torres starts with the close embrace and switches to the open one for the ochos.

Jorge Torres performed on stage in Forever Tango for years. Just because a known name in a video does something you like doesn't make him a "good dancer." Once a performer, always a performer. It's tough to kick the habit. The video is a good example of what performers sell to social dancers who buy whatever they're given as tango.

I danced only once with a tango professional in a milonga who changed his embrace. I had to switch to "thinking" mode. I prefer to surrender.

 

[Vincenze]

Jorge Torres performed on stage in Forever Tango for years. Just because a known name in a video does something you like doesn't make him a "good dancer." Once a performer, always a performer. It's tough to kick the habit. The video is a good example of what performers sell to social dancers who buy whatever they're given as tango.

He does "deep" ochos when the follower turns her body extensively. She can't turn as much if they stay in the close embrace.

I only count the woman's jump as a performance element in the combination. Everything else is pretty standard and nice.

 

[itwillhappen]

I´ve met so many argentines in my life that learned tango in my hometown Hamburg (Germany). They all claim on their homepage to have cut their teeth into Tango, to be deeply involved with the Tango all their life and so forth..

Sure, there is not much honesty in this area.
Here one counterexample of an Argentine who confessed to have learned tango in the age of 44 in Zurich/Switzerland when he had no job. AFAIK did he visit Tango-BsAs only this time and unfortunately passed away a few years later:

 

[Reuven Thetanguero]

A good dancer dynamically changes his embrace. Some steps require the close embrace, some open.

In this video Jorge Torres starts with the close embrace and switches to the open one for the ochos.

]

The video you linked to is not an example of a good dancer - it's an example of a good performer.
A good dancer may want to loosen his embrace from time to time, however you can do a whole tanda in closed embrace without the need to open up.
A good leader is one who makes the lady feel delighted having danced with him.

 

[itwillhappen]

i think he is a good dancer - but sells useless moves to his students.
A milonguero can to be a good dancer, but just a good leader is often enough.

 

[Vincenze]

Sure, there is not much honesty in this area.
Here one counterexample of an Argentine who confessed to have learned tango in the age of 44 in Zurich/Switzerland when he had no job. AFAIK did he visit Tango-BsAs only this time and unfortunately passed away a few years later:

The guy doesn't listen to the music at all. Though, the music is pretty fast, he moves sluggishly and off the beats.

There were tons of messages before on how a woman values musicality.

Let me show how "a good performer" dances in the close embrace to the music.

 

[jantango]

The guy doesn't listen to the music at all. Though, the music is pretty fast, he moves sluggishly and off the beats.

There were tons of messages before on how a woman values musicality.

Let me show how "a good performer" dances in the close embrace to the music.

Oscar Moyano danced in what was considered the top milonga of BsAs several years ago at Maipu 444. He wouldn't have been invited by Hector unless he danced well. He danced the music in my opinion. Tanturi/Campos is one of the standard orchestra recordings for the milongas in BA, and it's not fast music.

Everyone who knows how to dance well listens to the music. If not, one is going through the motions with no feeling.

Torres is a good tango performer, but not a social dancer. A performer exaggerates each step by lifting the feet off the floor for the audience; a milonguero keeps the feet quiet and on the floor.

 

[opendoor]

..Here one counterexample of an Argentine who..

The guy doesn't listen to the music at all. Though, the music is pretty fast, he moves sluggishly and off the beats..

I must contradict, Vincenze, but I fully understand what you feel watching this performance: Someone dancing small but with the opportunity for the entire floor at hand (at feet). This performance totally looks thwarted and cramped. But you have to include the circumstances, the context of this "show case". It was kind of an intitiation ritual in the guild of the traditional ronda dancers. Its by no means a recommendation as a teacher, a show dancer, or an artist. It was right the opposite. Every initiation is a humiliation of the self.

To the facts: What you find "sluggish", here means delayed, and thus really is an ambitious skill. "Off the beat" is correct, but stepping in between is much more demanding than simply hitting the strong accents. He finds a good balance between "in the music" and "in the rhythm", being slightly more on the musical side. He became aware of the cadencia section of this piece and reacted with fine foodwork. I don't know what else this man had shown on the dance floor. But this is a little master piece in self-effacement. And it is up to you to concider this as a positive or negative quality.

 

[ArbeeNYC]

The guy doesn't listen to the music at all. Though, the music is pretty fast, he moves sluggishly and off the beats.

I disagree. He's absolutely listening to the music. He's using both the rhythm and the melody in his dancing, which is far more interesting than simply looking for beats to step on, which will make you look a little mechanical. He maintains the embrace throughout; there's no need to do otherwise. Keeps his steps relatively small and small and leads his partner comfortably around the floor. I think he's moving about as fast as he needs to be moving; you could even easily slow this down on the pista.

 

[Vincenze]

Oscar Moyano danced in what was considered the top milonga of BsAs several years ago at Maipu 444. He wouldn't have been invited by Hector unless he danced well. He danced the music in my opinion.

Do you want to say that he was among the top dancers of the top BA milongas who danced very well?
I can only imagine how good are lesser dancers.

 

[Vincenze]

I disagree. He's absolutely listening to the music. He's using both the rhythm and the melody in his dancing, which is far more interesting than simply looking for beats to step on, which will make you look a little mechanical. He maintains the embrace throughout; there's no need to do otherwise. Keeps his steps relatively small and small and leads his partner comfortably around the floor.

No, stepping on the beat is the main rule in tango musicality.

I can't connect with a woman who doesn't step on the beat.
There is a lady who has taken numerous classes with her partner and who visits every milonga here. I invited her recently to a milonga tanda. I couldn't dance with her, we were not synchronized. Then, I watched her dancing with her partner. Surely, he didn't care about the music.

Then, there are musical phrases in a song. It's graceful to start your first step with the beginning of a phrase. But he misses it and steps afterwards.

As this topic is about the close embrace, I would say that he looks down, he must look forward.