Why is that sad? I’m generally in tshirt/pants myself most of the time, with the big weekend milongas i’ll toss on a dress shirt. And frankly don’t care what the followers wear
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JournalInTime
Forum Master
Same here. This evening, I danced with a women wearing short shorts and a sort of halter top, and she was totally covered in tattoos. Some dude described her as "the girl with all the tattoos," which is when I noticed the ink and the clothing that made the ink visible. I can honestly say that for the most part, it's eyes I look at and remember.
opendoor
Forum Master
You avoid examining the art of others because it requires time and effort: Even beyond taste preferences, his choreography in "María de Buenos Aires" meets high objective criteria: the spatial integration and use of the stage, the tension between solo dance and choreo of many couples on stage, the portrayal of emotions through movement, the tension between fast and slow scenes.
'Like' is subjective. No matter how much work has gone into it, whether or not it meets objective requirements, it may still be disliked.
ArbeeNYC
Forum Master
It doesn't matter how well they integrate space or use of the stage; it's not a style I enjoy watching. Has nothing to do with examining the art of others. There are plenty of others whose work I like. We all have our preferences.
ArbeeNYC
Forum Master
Some people care. And some make an obvious effort to care.
Miradamiranda
Well-Known Member
Attire… some people try to blend in as if tango clothes are a uniform and you won’t be taken seriously if you don’t look the part. Others try to stand out with something bold, or at least a bold color, so that one can be found again in the crowd. As in “right, the guy over there with the red jeans’ or ‘that lady over there with the golden pants’ and not ‘ the lady in the floral dress with bare midriff dancing with the guy in the blue shirt’ - which one, that one? - no the one over there, oh that one, no, the one over there… Nothing wrong with floral dresses or blue shirts, but sometimes there are too many in the same location.
But right now I’m trying to pick outfits for my coming weekend tango getaway where there is an explicit dress code of jackets and ties (requested) for men and general ‘chic’ for women because the dancing will take place in a casino ballroom.
Hmmm. Sparkly black retro dress with sparkles galore red jewelry?
Hmmm, a boldly designed one piece black pantsuit with some loud vintage art deco bling jewelry?
I’ll probably get lost in a sea of black and sparkles, but at least it will be elegant. I might have to redeem myself with casual summer dresses or white jeans with tank tops the following local milongas.
But right now I’m trying to pick outfits for my coming weekend tango getaway where there is an explicit dress code of jackets and ties (requested) for men and general ‘chic’ for women because the dancing will take place in a casino ballroom.
Hmmm. Sparkly black retro dress with sparkles galore red jewelry?
Hmmm, a boldly designed one piece black pantsuit with some loud vintage art deco bling jewelry?
I’ll probably get lost in a sea of black and sparkles, but at least it will be elegant. I might have to redeem myself with casual summer dresses or white jeans with tank tops the following local milongas.
JournalInTime
Forum Master
My philosophy on attire is that, provided that an outfit or a look is street-legal – unlike, say, total nudity or tactical body armor in most places – everybody at the milonga has the right to (1) dress that way if it makes them feel happy and comfortable, and (2) express a dislike for it in socially acceptable ways, such as by not inviting or accepting invitations from the wearer, and not in ill-mannered ways, such as by staring or making snide remarks. Dress codes that exclude street-legal attire strike me as "ill-mannered ways" that enjoy false legitimacy by dint of headcount – the many bullying the few, as it were – notably when respecting the code is costly and people are excluded as much for being unable to afford to meet it as for being unwilling to meet it.
All of which said, I dress conservatively. I wear tango shoes with socks, tango trousers, a good-quality belt, a proper men's shirt (or, if it's disgustingly hot and humid, a dress tee intended to be worn with a jacket), etc. As I have long hair, I attach it to keep it from bothering partners; the resulting look strongly resembles the "slicked back" hair of the 1920s except for a tight bun (not a "man bun," but a tiny knob at neck level). I also avoid fragrances out of respect for allergies, and jewelry that could snag clothing (I wear cufflinks at most). I do that not because I value tradition but because the look makes me feel happy and comfortable.
I do value not being just another guy with black trousers and one of those paisley print shirts that 50% of tangueros seem to wear these days. I like to be identifiable for the reasons that Miradamiranda gave. So, my trousers might be silvery, or my shirt rose-colored, or my shoes checkered. Something like that. On nights when I want to blend in and choose my partners rather than have them stalk me, I dress all in black, whereupon I resemble the other 50% of tangueros these days and can hide in crowds or shadows.
But my choices stop with me and don't affect my choice of partners. I dance with cooler-than-me goth girls dressed like vampires, "matronly" women who dress like sofas and passementeries, beyond-casual types in jeans and tees or halters, ladies in evening dress, tangueras who clearly just arrived from work in their power suits, and all the rest. I don't care if they wear makeup. I don't care if their hair is retro (say, 1960s), very retro (say, 1920s), conservative for business, bright pink, shaved off, or whatever. I don't care if they have untouched skin or 27 piercings and a tattooed face. I'm not dancing with their fashion statement, but with their tango technique, and I don't believe that my partner's mode influences who will dance with me later on – or to be precise, I don't care about dancing with anybody so shallow that they'd refuse to dance with me because I danced with, say, a skinny vampire girl with blue hair and a pierced nose.
My biggest issue with dress codes is, as I said, the rudeness they bring out in others. When someone says something like, "Look at how they're dressed. They have no respect!", what I hear is the critic saying, "I have no respect for others." Particularly when the dress code they prefer would cost the object of their criticism more than they can afford. There are of course critics who feel that economics are a good reason to exclude someone, but (1) that's classist, totally against my values, and cause never to speak to that person again, and (2) often wrong, because I can promise you that a fully-inked body in the latest goth fashion cost a lot more than some generic evening gown.
All of which said, I dress conservatively. I wear tango shoes with socks, tango trousers, a good-quality belt, a proper men's shirt (or, if it's disgustingly hot and humid, a dress tee intended to be worn with a jacket), etc. As I have long hair, I attach it to keep it from bothering partners; the resulting look strongly resembles the "slicked back" hair of the 1920s except for a tight bun (not a "man bun," but a tiny knob at neck level). I also avoid fragrances out of respect for allergies, and jewelry that could snag clothing (I wear cufflinks at most). I do that not because I value tradition but because the look makes me feel happy and comfortable.
I do value not being just another guy with black trousers and one of those paisley print shirts that 50% of tangueros seem to wear these days. I like to be identifiable for the reasons that Miradamiranda gave. So, my trousers might be silvery, or my shirt rose-colored, or my shoes checkered. Something like that. On nights when I want to blend in and choose my partners rather than have them stalk me, I dress all in black, whereupon I resemble the other 50% of tangueros these days and can hide in crowds or shadows.
But my choices stop with me and don't affect my choice of partners. I dance with cooler-than-me goth girls dressed like vampires, "matronly" women who dress like sofas and passementeries, beyond-casual types in jeans and tees or halters, ladies in evening dress, tangueras who clearly just arrived from work in their power suits, and all the rest. I don't care if they wear makeup. I don't care if their hair is retro (say, 1960s), very retro (say, 1920s), conservative for business, bright pink, shaved off, or whatever. I don't care if they have untouched skin or 27 piercings and a tattooed face. I'm not dancing with their fashion statement, but with their tango technique, and I don't believe that my partner's mode influences who will dance with me later on – or to be precise, I don't care about dancing with anybody so shallow that they'd refuse to dance with me because I danced with, say, a skinny vampire girl with blue hair and a pierced nose.
My biggest issue with dress codes is, as I said, the rudeness they bring out in others. When someone says something like, "Look at how they're dressed. They have no respect!", what I hear is the critic saying, "I have no respect for others." Particularly when the dress code they prefer would cost the object of their criticism more than they can afford. There are of course critics who feel that economics are a good reason to exclude someone, but (1) that's classist, totally against my values, and cause never to speak to that person again, and (2) often wrong, because I can promise you that a fully-inked body in the latest goth fashion cost a lot more than some generic evening gown.
opendoor
Forum Master
Congrats, you've written a nice little miniature here! I enjoyed reading. Are you using it for your book?
I disagree on one point:
I disagree on one point:
Authenticity has always been important to me, even in tango. I prefer people who dress at the milonga as if we were meeting in a restaurant that evening. There were times when I didn't follow this pattern and dressed up as if for a role-play. But that actually was a long time ago.
JournalInTime
Forum Master
Haha! There won't be a book on tango unless I retire . . . and even then, it'd be competing with 1,000 other books on tango.
That's your choice, of course.
I respect the effort that goes into a look, but the look itself isn't important. I lived through the first wave of punk, new wave, goth, etc., and know as a fact that certain looks that don't appeal to the "conservative evening dress" crowd take many times more effort to maintain than evening dress. Most suit-and-tie guys can jump into a suit and tie on their way out the door – my father did it for decades. That just doesn't work for a carefully curated "alternative" look, which can take hours for each outing.
But what I was really getting at was how my partners' look affects my success with inviting other partners. In essence, being judged – regardless of my look – not for me, but for my partners, and not even for their skill, but for their appearance. I fail to see how "willing to dance with someone not in conservative evening dress" reflects on me in the slightest . . . that's like someone refusing to eat at the same table as me because they're vegetarian and, even though I'm not eating meat, they saw me at a barbecue place with someone else who eats meat one time. It's just weird.
I have a fundamental issue with what I call "social contagion" like this. If I'm hanging around with fascists or baby-killers, I can understand why you'd avoid me. But if I'm hanging around with people who dress a way you don't like, eat things you disapprove of, drive a model of car you dislike, or whatever, and I'm not doing any of those things myself, I completely fail to grasp why you'd judge me for those actions which aren't mine. Judging others by the harmless actions of their friends and acquaintances rather than by their own actions is the root of a lot of prejudice. In effect, it's promoting "harmless" to "harmful" to justify discrimination on the grounds of secondhand discomfort.
TTanguero
Forum Master
The huge irony to me is that I wear very 'boring' colours: a white linen shirt (I have a dozen identical ones) and a pair of tango trousers that are either black, a very dark navy blue that probably looks black, or a very dark grey that probably looks black. Yet when I'm looking for photos of myself at events, 'white shirt and [almost] black trousers' actually stands out really well from the sea of more 'interesting' clothing!
JournalInTime
Forum Master
Between the ninjas dressed all in black, and the people hornswoggled into buying special "tango shirts" that are in funky prints but also kind of hot, plain old white stands out. I've noticed exactly the same thing when looking at photos of myself at events! My issues with white are how it becomes . . . well, let's say "not white" when dancing with people who wear makeup. Even those with excellent head posture seem to shed little particles of color.
pianistamediano
Forum Master
A T-shirt — usually a breathable, swift-drying blend of synthetic/natural fabrics — and chino pants, both usually solid colours, but I have a collection of cat T-shirts that I love to wear. I use them to lord over everyone, as befits their inherent superiority and quasi-divine nature.
It's hard to find clothes that fit me (aren't too loose, too tight, flatter my body structure, etc.) general without paying for tailoring because I have a tiny waist, but enough of a physique that I recently had to retire several pairs of pants, shorts and shirts. (I'm not too much for baggy, loose clothing either, but I do get loose fitting pants as a compromise between my love for chino and the way tango pants are really billowy.)
If it's ~20°C or above, I tend to replace my top with a sleeveless t-shirt (which I use for lounging around the house or exercising), and maybe even chino shorts if it's an outdoor milongas. Still wear my regular tango shoes though, I have yet to find a good pair of shoes that I can both dance in and go to the gym in.
I've long given up wearing a proper shirt, because I just sweat way too much for that, and drying them takes ages compared to a nice T-shirt, and I'd rather not dance with followers who think my clothes say something about my dancing — it's a great filter.
It's hard to find clothes that fit me (aren't too loose, too tight, flatter my body structure, etc.) general without paying for tailoring because I have a tiny waist, but enough of a physique that I recently had to retire several pairs of pants, shorts and shirts. (I'm not too much for baggy, loose clothing either, but I do get loose fitting pants as a compromise between my love for chino and the way tango pants are really billowy.)
If it's ~20°C or above, I tend to replace my top with a sleeveless t-shirt (which I use for lounging around the house or exercising), and maybe even chino shorts if it's an outdoor milongas. Still wear my regular tango shoes though, I have yet to find a good pair of shoes that I can both dance in and go to the gym in.
I've long given up wearing a proper shirt, because I just sweat way too much for that, and drying them takes ages compared to a nice T-shirt, and I'd rather not dance with followers who think my clothes say something about my dancing — it's a great filter.
Well, I see 90% of discussion is about men clothes. Is time to change. Guys, what is your experience with women breasts if you dance in close embrace? Openly, is easy to dance with flat-chested girls. Good contact, sharing of info, etc. If girls are wearing push-up bra, I start to have issues. Breasts are formed into two hard bumpers she is pushing against me. I prefere if she wears sport-bra, then I have connection over whole space of chest. Third cathegory are "gifted" ones (including my wife). It is not easy to lead thru mass of two airbags. Interesting thing is, size is not linked to close embrace preference. (sorry for little uncorect topic, I was bored by T-shirts)
Initially perturbing**; nowadays just matter-of-fact. Women come equipped with them. Just another body shape.
I just don't like bandeau tops, of those with ties, requiring continuous adjustments and additional needs to be careful.
I suppose tangueras have views on miloguero belly, or lack of?
**Not too many amazonion women, but I used to dance regularly with one in lessons (lovely lady
) where you sort of wondered where to look (especially not straight ahead), or put your head. A case of best behaviour and needing a cold shower after a tanda.