Question about tandas

[dchester]

If a competent teacher is unable to identify the problems you have then it is unlikely that they are so major to warrant a follower putting you down in the middle of the tanda without an explanation. If you paid attention to basic hygiene, didn't bump her into anyone, and in general there are no clear causes of her acting that way, it is very likely to be pointless to ask for her reasons.

With out going into a long debate, I'll just say that I don't agree with you at all. People have different preferences and styles, and they don't all match the teachers. Not all followers want the same thing.

No, the right attitude in a milonga, me thinks, is that a no means no, period. Don't ask for an explanation and don't expect one, you are not there to pressure her into explaining herself and you are not there to be told how much you suck. Do that in the practicas and classes, and leave the milonga for maximizing the fun of dancing.

I think a prior post of mine might have confused you. You appear to have made the erroneous assumption that I ask followers what they didn't like about my dancing when getting thank youed. I don't. The only time I really ask for feedback is at a practica (and it's not when getting thank youed).

What I said was that I would prefer for a follower to actually tell me what they didn't like rather than just getting the thank you. I also would like for there to be peace on earth, and to win the next $100,000,000 lottery. Unfortunately, none of these things are likely to happen, and I'm able to live with it.

As you chose to lecture me, I'll return the favor. Reading is fundamental, and it's not wise to make assumptions based on poor reading. Just because someone has a preference, doesn't mean they do anything to make others abide by that preference.

 

[Subliminal]

If a competent teacher is unable to identify the problems you have then it is unlikely that they are so major to warrant a follower putting you down in the middle of the tanda without an explanation. If you paid attention to basic hygiene, didn't bump her into anyone, and in general there are no clear causes of her acting that way, it is very likely to be pointless to ask for her reasons.

No, the right attitude in a milonga, me thinks, is that a no means no, period. Don't ask for an explanation and don't expect one, you are not there to pressure her into explaining herself and you are not there to be told how much you suck. Do that in the practicas and classes, and leave the milonga for maximizing the fun of dancing.

Yeah, I'm not sure if you wanted to come off that way, but that sounds pretty harsh.

It's true, no means no. However, it's also true that if a lady wishes to say "thank you" with no explanation, there is a good chance she will not get asked to dance by the same leader ever again. Which may be what she wants.

(Unless they are a very annoying and persistent bad leader, in which case it may take more than a "thank you" to clue them in. heh.)

 

[gyb]

First, in case I came through as harsh, the harshness was unintended and I apologize.

With out going into a long debate, I'll just say that I don't agree with you at all. People have different preferences and styles, and they don't all match the teachers. Not all followers want the same thing.

I'm fine with not debating and then sorry to repeat but I think there is a quite serious difference between not liking a tanda with someone - say, due to differences in style, embrace, musical preference - and not liking it to the extent to leave him in the middle of it, which is the case I discussed. Followers should be able to recognize the difference between not getting exactly what they want and getting something which is so bad as to interrupt the tanda. The latter case, unless it has to do with bad hygiene, injury, making sexual advances, or other similar gravely uncomfortable technical issues should be identifiable by a competent teacher. If a teacher is unable to see through differences in style to identify such serious issues is not competent as a teacher IMHO. This is a qualification which was present in my post.

I think a prior post of mine might have confused you. You appear to have made the erroneous assumption that I ask followers what they didn't like about my dancing when getting thank youed. I don't. The only time I really ask for feedback is at a practica (and it's not when getting thank youed).

What I said was that I would prefer for a follower to actually tell me what they didn't like rather than just getting the thank you. I also would like for there to be peace on earth, and to win the next $100,000,000 lottery. Unfortunately, none of these things are likely to happen, and I'm able to live with it.

I didn't assume that you ask followers what they didn't like in your dancing, but I did assume that you'd expect to get an explanation in such case. I think this assumption was not entirely unreasonable given that you said you would prefer this to happen; if you also tell this preference of yours to people in your local community I'm pretty sure it will come through as an expectation. I addressed the expectation part, and then for completeness added the asking part.

As you chose to lecture me, I'll return the favor. Reading is fundamental, and it's not wise to make assumptions based on poor reading. Just because someone has a preference, doesn't mean they do anything to make others abide by that preference.

I didn't mean to lecture you specifically but to state general advices regarding milonga attitudes which I think come with definite advantages to all. Let's not play the blame-game of who is the uncharitable reader of the other.

 

[newbie]

what a follower at some milonga didn't like. Only the follower can do that (if she chooses to).

That could be the start of a new thread. Followers telling why they left their leader alone on the dance floor and went back to their seat while in the middle of a tanda. I bet the reasons are not so different from one follower to another.

-) Jennifer came in with new shoes and I *have* to ask her where she bought them.
-) An argentine/teacher came in and I must harpoon him before the other chicks do.
-) My cell phone is blinking.
-) The guy is too good, makes me look like a beginner, the other ladies are not jealous when they see me dancing.

 

[Dave Bailey]

This 'Thank you' business is plain daft. Does anyone know its history?

I'm familiar with the convention, but have offended against it more than once, just out of the habit of thanking my partner for the pleasure of a dance. How, on earth, did words that in any other setting on earth would express gratitude or appreciation come to mean 'This is so awful, that I'm going to stop now and return to my seat'?

Cultural translation issue... I know I have to explicitly tell my students about it, otherwise they'll usually say "thank you" automatically after each dance, with the obvious results.

I don't think it's a particularly brilliant custom for us, simply because "thank you" means something different in the UK, but I think we're stuck with it.

 

[twnkltoz]

that could be the start of a new thread. Followers telling why they left their leader alone on the dance floor and went back to their seat while in the middle of a tanda. I bet the reasons are not so different from one follower to another.

-) jennifer came in with new shoes and i *have* to ask her where she bought them.
-) an argentine/teacher came in and i must harpoon him before the other chicks do.
-) my cell phone is blinking.
-) the guy is too good, makes me look like a beginner, the other ladies are not jealous when they see me dancing.

lol!!

 

[dchester]

-) My cell phone is blinking.

I actually saw that for the first time, this past New Years Eve. At first, I thought it was a joke, but this follower had a cell phone to her ear in the middle of a tanda, then she left the guy in the middle of the song to talk on the phone.

 

[nucat78]

I actually saw that for the first time, this past New Years Eve. At first, I thought it was a joke, but this follower had a cell phone to her ear in the middle of a tanda, then she left the guy in the middle of the song to talk on the phone.

Might have been a family emergency. Otherwise...

 

[twnkltoz]

Might have been a family emergency. Otherwise...

Yes, I have to imagine it had to be a very important phone call.

 

[Angel HI]

Au cas ou I have never said it, welcome to the DF, GYB.

...but I think there is a quite serious difference between not liking a tanda with someone - say, due to differences in style, embrace, musical preference - and not liking it to the extent to leave him in the middle of it.

That could be the start of a new thread. Followers telling why they left their leader alone on the dance floor and went back to their seat while in the middle of a tanda.

Cultural translation issue....

I actually saw that for the first time,.... but this follower had a cell phone to her ear in the middle of a tanda, then she left the guy in the middle of the song to talk on the phone.

The cultural difference of the usage of "thank you" is valid. Other than that, unless there is serious mitigating circumstance, there is no excuse for rudeness and disrespect. Period. No thread needed.

 

[Zoopsia59]

-) Jennifer came in with new shoes and I *have* to ask her where she bought them.
-) An argentine/teacher came in and I must harpoon him before the other chicks do.
-) My cell phone is blinking.
-) The guy is too good, makes me look like a beginner, the other ladies are not jealous when they see me dancing.

I'm assuming this post is meant to be tongue in cheek.

 

[newbie]

I'm assuming this post is meant to be tongue in cheek.

Not necessarily. The situation described in the posts is a leader being left alone on the dancefloor by his follower, without any explanation and without any mistakes by the leader. Yet it did happen. And not just once.

One new reason I can think is the "just because", semi-random decision. The lady looks at her watch and if the minute needle is between 39 and 31 then she leaves.

 

[twnkltoz]

How about this: when there are no cortinas, is it rude to automatically say thank you at the end of the third dance? I've done that and still had the guy ask if he can have a fourth, but then it occurs to me that other times it might have been rude....should I wait for the guy to decide he's done with me, or is it normal and expected to say thank you after three, but that doesn't mean I would say no to another if he wants it?

 

[opendoor]

Re: etiquette?

Hi Jennifer, I did not read the entire thread, so excuse me, if the current questions have already been answered, yet.

What is the etiquette?

A leader should not ask a woman to dance at the end of a single piece.

can you start in the third song...but then if you do, do you hang on and dance two more after the transition?

You can start at anywhere, and continue dancing into the next tanda. Note, attentive dancers around will notice if you finish up dancing already after only one or two pieces, at all.

are you off the hook unless you really want to keep going?

Usually we all dance 3 or 4 pieces with a person. But sometimes it is hard to find an appropriate dancer on the floor anyway. Under this circumstances it can happen, that I keep on dancing with the same woman for more than 3 tandas. But, you have to communicate about this to each other, then.

 

[dchester]

How about this: when there are no cortinas, is it rude to automatically say thank you at the end of the third dance? I've done that and still had the guy ask if he can have a fourth, but then it occurs to me that other times it might have been rude....should I wait for the guy to decide he's done with me, or is it normal and expected to say thank you after three, but that doesn't mean I would say no to another if he wants it?

If there are no cortinas, I'm not sure what the rule is. However, in general if there's anything questionable (leaving the tanda early, or turning down a dance request), the way most women make it clear that they are not dissing the leader, is by saying something like, "I hope you'll ask me again later tonight (or at the next milonga)".