Tango Diaries

[Bailango]

Bailango, you don't really dance in shorts in summer, do you?

I do.

 

[Brummbaer]

I don’t see anyone at tango asking for partner’s permission either. Rather it is harder to ask for a permission of someone else when invitation is by cabaceo.

That's because of 'couples' - and the circumstances, and whether that simplistic 'rule' applies. Sometimes (rarely) there are clearly couples and solos. But, if you're known within the social group, and known that either partner dances with others, then just ask. If, say, it was a new, unknown, couple, then it might be polite to engage in conversation with both first. But then, sometimes, he dances with others (sometimes poorly - and it's the thing to do at a milonga!), but she's left ironing a seat.

Milongas are not homogenous - however much the pedants would like that!

 

[TTanguero]

his dance partner should be escorted back from the dance floor. That's simply salon etiquette. The tango codigos also include this

You would certainly cause offence if you failed to do so at a traditional milonga. Even in London, I did a little Facebook poll and the results were very clear: a minority of followers expected it; the vast majority appreciated it; one was offended by it.

It has a very practical reason: many followers close their eyes when dancing and may be disorientated in terms of where they are in the room in relation to their table.

 

[itwillhappen]

It has a very practical reason: many followers close their eyes when dancing and may be disorientated in terms of where they are in the room in relation to their table.

The service also includes remembering where she left her glasses and returning her back.
You may also leave your own glasses in the same place or or carry them with you, if needed to find the way...

 

[itwillhappen]

Agree about the ancient cabeceo/mirada, but whether it's relevant nowadays to sparing that unfriendly 'no' is a moot point and depends on the group (we're all friends and acquaintances, so no one needs to play games, especially ladies who don't want to spend an evening ironing chairs).

I probably know mostly high-achieving tangueras. And they would certainly be grateful if at least those guys they don't want to dance with would use the cabeceo. They're after all lenient with the dancers they're aiming for.

 

[itwillhappen]

That's because of 'couples' - and the circumstances, and whether that simplistic 'rule' applies.

I don't think it would be a good idea here in Northern Europe to seriously ask a woman's companion for permission. However, I sometimes do it as a joke, just as I sometimes thank her companion for bringing such a wonderful dancer to the milonga.

The situation is completely different if you don't even look at someones companion, even if he or she is sitting or standing next. But tango allows some people with social issues to participate in social life, and that's ultimately a good thing, isn't it?

 

[opendoor]

..has a very practical reason: many followers close their eyes when dancing and may be disorientated in terms of where they are in the room in relation to their table.

For me its the other way round: I usually leave my glasses at that table. So I'm escorted back by the lady to that place!

 

[brujo]

There are other ways people ask to dance vs cabeceo or verbal offer. In salsa or WCS a lot of times the inviter extends their hands out and the other person can choose to take it or walk over or just shake their heads or do a verbal no. This is a bit more obvious than a cabeceo. It also works well in festivals and such when you’re not quite sure how fluent the other person is in your language.

I’ve also just seen people do the ASL sign for dancing which is dominant hand makes the floor and then you make a V with your other hand and pretend to be two legs walking.

The only difference there is that the rejection to the man is just more visible compared to a cabeceo.

I don’t hate the cabeceo, it works and I’ve never had problems using it to ask for a dance. But sometimes it feels like that time explaining it to beginners could be better used teaching them how to navigate a dance floor.

 

[itwillhappen]

Dear Diary...

...we neglect the traumas that come with social interaction in tango. If you can still vividly recall (or imagine you can recall) a rejection or criticism ten years or more later, then that's a mild trauma.

Nothing more and nothing less, and it doesn't require any action. But it wasn't "nothing either" - most unimportant things are forgotten immediately.

 

[brujo]

It has a very practical reason: many followers close their eyes when dancing and may be disorientated in terms of where they are in the room in relation to their table.

In my mention of salsa where walking a person back to the table being creepy is that there are no tandas in salsa and no cortinas either. So by holding on to them and insisting on walking them back you’re kinda taking away a big bit of their next dance. Also if you sucked they don’t want to give you one additional second of their time. What if they just want to grab the next person available and stay on the dance floor?

I’ve found often that things in Latin America that were often flaunted as normal and “of course you do that” like opening car doors all the time, insisting on walking on the outside and paying for the date can often get resistance and even a lot of pushback in white people culture. This could be good or bad. There are more people dancing with each other regardless of gender in other dances that don’t have a Hispanic history. Maybe Europe has a thriving tango scene and this doesn’t matter there but in the US it feels like a lot of these rules create a sense of exclusivity and only allow those who strongly conform to what a tango dancer should be to participate.

 

[itwillhappen]

but in the US it feels like a lot of these rules create a sense of exclusivity and only allow those who strongly conform to what a tango dancer should be to participate.

Guys like these two?

 

[opendoor]

...but in the US it feels like a lot of these rules create a sense of exclusivity and only allow those who strongly conform to what a tango dancer should be to participate.

I bet you also have tango dissidents, alternative milongas, neolongas and informal flash mobs. Look for it!

 

[itwillhappen]

There are other ways people ask to dance vs cabeceo or verbal offer. In salsa or WCS a lot of times the inviter extends their hands out and the other person can choose to take it or walk over or just shake their heads or do a verbal no.

So it's clear that different behaviors have developed in salsa than in tango. Given the different circumstances, this doesn't surprise me. And maybe you can change your own behavior to a limited extent, but practically not that of others.

It's simply the way it is; you generally can't just pick and choose a feature from one scene and another from another at will. Unless, perhaps, you're realizing your vision as an organizer. But many of the ideas that come to mind are more trivial than visionary.

Generally speaking, what has become established is proven to be suited; what hasn't become established was obviously unsuited. Of course, one can have desires, but if one doesn't understand reality, one probably hasn't grasped all the interrelationships.

 

[brujo]

Guys like these two?

( Note: I am an Asian man )

I’m not sure if your post was about just the attitude of the dancers. But I’d like to talk about the race component.

In the US dancing is one of the forms of safe racism that Asian men are allowed to participate in. There is an author named Phil Chan who chronicles this in ballet on books like Final Bow for Yellowface or Banishing Orientalism.

You look at the ballroom scene in the Bay Area and you’ll see a lot of the dancers are Asian. I think because it conforms very heavily to the social script of male / female roles and it’s non-threatening.

For me, dance felt like a way to finally be allowed to talk to girls after an entire tiger parent life of having to focus on school and career, in a social script that came from an era where people were still doing arranged marriages. But even that ran into a lot of resistance from my mother who saw it as a waste of time and money.

Now, with K-Pop being super popular and things like the show on Netflix where Brazilians compete for the love of an Asian man, it feels like some of my younger compatriots are finally able to be a little more free with their dating and expressing their sexuality.

So it’s awesome that these two dudes can be total entitled douches. But you can also see the competitive nature of just being Asian in a lot of their discussions, where you have to be really really good to even stand out to get a dance.

Also, they are almost exactly the type of folks you would expect in a milonga. In our local milonga we have a few Hispanics, but they are outnumbered by Koreans, Taiwanese and Japanese men. We have two black guys that show up only once in a while. So yes, those guys are kinda exactly who you’d think of that matches what a tango dancer should be.

 

[itwillhappen]

( Note: I am an Asian man )

I’m not sure if your post was about just the attitude of the dancers. But I’d like to talk about the race component.

Be sure that it was both.