What makes you cringe in tango?

[Rabbit]

The milonga venue should function as a third space. It doesn't really matter exactly what type of space it is so long as the community creates a good atmosphere

We don't have dedicated tango venues either, just places which also host other dance styles. I wouldn't mind a dedicated tango venue but it seems to be a luxury that can only exist where rents are low.

 

[opendoor]

The milonga venue should function as a third space..

Agreed

We don't have dedicated tango venues either, just places which also host other dance styles..

Which venues rent to other styles? What is their philosophy or business model, Rabbit? The tango studio, whose photos I uploaded, also rents out to other styles, and mostly to private parties.

 

[Brummbaer]

I understand, Brummbaer, you identify more with the ordinary tango people. But try changing your perspective and consider the thoughts an aspiring tango professional will have.

Many aspire; few make it.

And I certainly have more affinity with Carmen Calderón's quote: Tango comes from the slums, not the dancehall. If you don't see or feel that, then you're dead.

The 'aspiring tango professional' also has several connotations from those who started early (there's a thread on the BR forum re youngsters learning BR for competition), to those sofa-surfing the world giving 'workshops'. But, of course, there can also be good, successful, stable, businesses.

It's not the space (although that can help with teaching), but affordability and the social context - and I dislike elitist, pedantic, tango snobs who merit the full cringefactor.

 

[Rabbit]

Which venues rent to other styles? What is their philosophy or business model, Rabbit? The tango studio, whose photos I uploaded, also rents out to other styles, and mostly to private parties.

there are a couple of generic dance studios, but also clubs, community centres or other venues that happen to have a suitable floor

 

[tangoing]

(Just musing) your tango teachers (which are many) make a living on privates rather than than to cultivate the field (I mean holding beginner group classes). On the other hand, there still are many BR studios and schools in NYC, both chained and independent (as far as Google reveils).

Those aren't really mutually exclusive, in fact they're more complimentary if anything. I imagine the Tango teachers who make the most from privates may be the ones hosting regular beginner/intermediate classes since that's their direct funnel for new people taking their privates.

 

[tangoing]

I've only ever discovered one dedicated tango 'studio' (in the sense you use about BR). I do find the 'tango studio' concept slightly cringeworthy (even if good). Perhaps on the basis that they were also selling a lifestyle - and then we're back to all the AT extras beyond a dance which, as discussed many times previously, can put off those who become interested, or make those who think they know the secret rules to club membership 'elitest'.

I was just referring to studio space where the majority of the activities are Tango related, nothing to do with lifestyle or membership stuff

 

[opendoor]

..have more affinity with Carmen Calderón's quote: Tango comes from the slums, not the dancehall..

As I already wrote, I'm on your side. I also always felt out of place at tango balls in glittering baroque halls. But don't fall for Carmencita's fairy tales: She helped with the Argentine reinterpretation and self-mythologizing, because the tango of the Guardia Nueva was danced in the refined cabarets.

 

[Bailango]

It depends what's a 'real' tango studio! My reservation is, perhaps, about those offering a 'lifestyle'. And then it depends on what 'lifestyle' means. I'm not into an 'alternative' (or 'wellness', or 'zen', or ...) lifestyle, or 'community' living - where some seek refuge. If it's a 'studio' then I want to learn the moves of the dance and how to execute them well technically. I'm not buying into some aspiration of 1940's (or earlier) Argentinian culture, nor some elitest club. I was quite content during the beginner phase with someone who had an AT dance curriculum (not sequences), could teach well with continuity between lessons, and used the old community hall with a passable floor. Even with clearing the remnants of a wake or a party from the floor before we could use it. It was never 'home'.

No objection to a dedicated space! I do recollect dancing once in a comfortable tango 'clubroom' in München (the wonders of a Verein!)- with sofas, chairs and low coffee tables - but hardly a 'dance studio'.

I think you have created a pre-conceived notion of what a “tango studio” is. While we never had dedicated tango studio (except for one instructor who tried it for two years), a studio dedicated to tango shouldn’t mean a certain lifestyle. It can be a space to practice and learn dancing. I have seen such studios during my travel.

We have what you can call one dedicated tango studio. However the owner is neither an instructor nor dances tango. The studio is primarily booked by different tango instructors (both local and visiting) for classes, workshops, practicas, occasional milonga. When he got priced out of original studio place in the heart of the city, he bought another where the rest of buildings are small warehouses.

There is another space which is an art gallery and art workshop. A former assistant to instructors got it in inheritance. He uses it to host regular live tango music and milonga once or twice a month.

In the cities where leasing or owning a space is affordable I have seen dedicated Tango studios where the owners are tango instructors. Their weekly calendar has group classes, practicas, milongas. I am guessing they do privates too and sometimes rent out the space.

 

[opendoor]

..In the cities where leasing or owning a space is affordable I have seen dedicated Tango studios where..

Do BR studios have fewer problems paying space than tango studios?

 

[Brummbaer]

Do BR studios have fewer problems paying space than tango studios?

That obviously depends on the economy, numbers attending and paying, etc. It's all relative! I can pay as little as 4-5€ for a great milonga in a community hall, but typical is 12-15€ in a similar venue. I might pay 30-40€ for a larger venue in a metopolis (and there might be several hundred there in an expensive-to-hire hall). If there's a workshop pre-milonga, that might be another 8-15€, but that gets complicated depending on the quality of 'workshop'. I'd pay more for a good 'workshop'. Maybe any post-workshop milonga/practica is included.

Smaller milongas might have 10-40 (peak) attendees. There were 16 at the last two milongas I attended; lowest number has been 6.

I've come across BR dance schools now offering beginners AT (aftermath of Strictly/DWTS), but that's mainly (entirely?) BR studios offering something more with paying customers. Not come across anyone (recently) from those 'schools', but generally expect ballroom AT from that source.

Except maybe in a large metropolis (London?) I'd guess there aren't sufficient numbers for a dedicated AT 'studio'. Space is generally too expensive and numbers too low. You might find an AT group using a general dance studio if the prices are ok - but I've also been in the basement of blocks of flats in London (actually in an expensive area, but that's complicated) because everywhere else is expensive.

I"d guess BR has more money, or can charge more, perhaps from people who are willing to spend more to perform, or 'win'.

 

[Brummbaer]

I think you have created a pre-conceived notion of what a “tango studio” is

Nope. But it's based in a very small sample and qualified by my first sentence: What is a 'real', dedicated, tango studio? I highlighted my observations an experiences. I've only come across one other format, which was far different than what I see in images from BsAs.

While we never had dedicated tango studio (except for one instructor who tried it for two years),

...

 

[brujo]

The dedicated tango studio I go to hosts milongas, classes and practicas. But it’s also a space for other dances like fusion and Lindy hop events. It’s great because it is decorated with fun tango motifs and even has a bandoneon bench at the door

 

[JournalInTime]

even has a bandoneon chair at the door

I love this!

One of my regular places regularly displays a bandoneon near the entrance; you can touch it (under a watchful eye, of course!) and get a feeling for how it works. They also have Mundial/TangoBA livery all over the place, because they hosted a qualifier in 2025 and will do so again in 2026 – and big screens on many of the walls display Mundial performances in constant rotation. Also, they have tango art painted by a local artist.

Another has a full-time "exchange" near the entrance, where you can buy and sell tango shoes and clothing. Inside, they have paintings of tango dancers, painted by a tanguera who dances there. Oh, and there's a piano with tango sheet music against one wall. Remaining free wall space is given to framed posters on tango traditions and etiquette. The high windows boast tango-themed decals, and when the sun comes in during afternoon or early evening events, these project tango-themed silhouettes on the floor.

Two others have tango boutiques where you can buy a full range of shoes and clothing for him and her. They also have bars, with prominently displayed "Tango Bar" signs. There's a little tango art, too, though not as much of it as at the above two places. They keep their information on tango etiquette in smaller frames, in the restrooms.

One that I frequent less often has a giant wrought-iron sculpture of a couple dancing tango mounted on the corner, visible from all four streets of its intersection. They, too, have tango art on their walls, and a "Tango Bar." Their cloakroom is below street level and totally decorated for tango.

And the one where I used to work before it closed had a boutique, a "Tango Bar," and two pianos. The very large windows along two walls sported huge decals of tango dancers.

I find such touches – tango signage, posters, decals, livery, paintings, sculpture, videos, clothing, shoes, instruments, etc. – wonderful. I also love proper Art-Deco, Beaux-Arts, Edwardian Classical, or late Gothic Revival ballrooms with ample wood, marble, and glass, boasting fancy chandeliers, grand staircases, statuary, and high-end lighting and sound systems designed to produce a "gala" experience for hundreds of guests. Some might find all of the above tacky, but I like to be able to pretend I'm dancing in the 1930s, or to feel immersed due to the tributes to tango around me. To me, dancing in a generic loft, basement, gym, or multifunctional space feels less legitimately like dancing at a milonga, and is nearly a source of cringe.

The most cringe space ever was probably a concrete-floored "cultural center" that was plainly not even meant for dancing. The floor was horrid, the sound echoed badly, there were bizarre corners everywhere, and there wasn't even a mirror or a barre somewhere to suggest it was used for dance in some capacity. It was like dancing in a concrete interrogation room.

 

[Brummbaer]

It was like dancing in a concrete interrogation room.

I mentioned dancing (lesson+ practica) in the basement of a block of flats in London. Some quite expensive properties around. Certainly not "The Crypt"! 'Interrogation Room' certainly described the decor. Strangely it was a very welcoming group - and the (vinyl?) floor wasn't bad. Insufficient numbers to merit a 'studio'. Interestingly quite an upmarket, elitest, tango venue nearby.

 

[JournalInTime]

I mentioned dancing (lesson+ practica) in the basement of a block of flats in London. Some quite expensive properties around.

Oh, residences are a whole other category!

I have almost no friends whose homes are large enough to host bona fide milongas. One couple certainly could: They own a veritable mansion, and removing the furniture and concert grand from the great room (which has hardwood floors) would create more space than all but our largest milongas. Also, Mister is a semi-professional tango DJ with an expensive sound system. Now I just have to convince him to do it.

But my expectations as a guest at a dancer's home differ profoundly from my expectations for a milonga, just as my expectations as a guest at a dinner party differ profoundly from my expectations for a restaurant. I'd never characterize a gathering at a residence as a "milonga." I'd call it a "private party," closer to an encuentro than anything else.

Certainly not "The Crypt"!

Hah! Could you even dance around all those columns?

the (vinyl?) floor wasn't bad.

Anything but unpolished concrete! I've danced on wood (strip, plank, and parquet), bamboo, marble, polished concrete, tile (ceramic and plastic), and various surface treatments (Marley, linoleum, etc.) over several of the above. I like a floating bamboo floor best, and a floating hardwood strip floor second-best. Parquet and Marley (what your vinyl probably was) aren't bad, if the underlying surface is good and ideally floating. But unpolished concrete is horrendous, which is why I disliked the "interrogation room" so much.

Well, that and the sound. It's probably a personal quirk, but I find dancing with echoes unpleasant.

One of the best experiences I had was at a huge, theoretically echo-prone ex-cathedral that had one of those sound systems that actively cancels echoes, involving "hundreds" of microphones to pick up echoes for cancellation, real-time processing, line arrays, and kilowatts of output capable of sustaining a sound pressure of 100 dB (but you'd never want it that high). Apparently, it won a national prize. It was wild to "feel" the sound as if it were local at all points on the floor, not coming from some faraway speaker or bouncing off a wall.