At the end of the pandemic, maybe a new start?

[ArbeeNYC]

People mostly go there just to dance, and talk within their own groups.

Unfortunate. That leads to cliques and a diminished sense of community.

 

[pianistamediano]

Just had a great night — a follower I enjoy dancing with asked me for a second tanda after we'd just danced a Canaro milonga tanda. And she phrased it in a way that would let me decline her if I wasn't feeling the music. It's always lovely when a dancer acknowledges your tastes and is so understanding. Then Tres Esquinas came on, and so we smiled at each other and danced!

Unfortunately, a follower I had seen on the pista and was curious about ignored my cabeceo — pretty sure I made it clear, what with me changing locations for a better line of sight, so it is what it is.

Two hours later, had a great Biagi/Duval tanda (not the more cheerful/romantic ones, think it started with Triste Comedia and ended with Alguien) with another follower, who listened and danced to his piano. Maybe it's just where I dance or whom I dance with, but I find it uncommon that followers listen and dance well and precisely (this is the important part!), specifically to those absolutely delicious piano solos, even if I let them have the moment. Had a half-grin on my face for nearly the whole tanda; she danced beautifully.

I decided not to try my luck with that follower again (even though my favourite Di Sarli tanda was coming up) in order to preserve my good mood and the good vibes from that Biagi tanda, so I left soon after.

All in all, I'm satisfied!

 

[itwillhappen]

Urgent call to defer the "new start" not too long:

Getting Physical | Tangofolly

Re Tango Essays & Opinions - I suppose few among you watch Chicho and Juana perform, wondering if their knees will hold? Well, I do. They appear to be human, so I figure they must

tangofolly.com

 

[opendoor]

a woman told me this was her last night of tango, ever... danced on pain killers now.. wearing high heels for too many long.. nights, was inoperable and the only option left was quitting tango altogether..

This is exactly what is happening at home now. My girlfriend can no longer dance in heels. Right or not at all. She says and wants to draw a line after 35 years. No sneaker seems sexy enough. The tango princess finds it difficult to pass the crown.

 

[pianistamediano]

I have calluses on the inner sides of my feet, and mild/moderate bunions on my big toes. I'd imagine I'm genetically predisposed to get them, since my mother has them too. So to manage them, I massage and stretch them, crack the big toes if they feel tense/compressed, especially after a milonga, and wear toe spreaders.

Of course, the biggest thing that helps is that I have custom split-shoe shoes, where the upper sole is one size larger to give my toes adequate room. And I try to be careful about how I walk, and never use too much force.

 

[itwillhappen]

What might have gone wrong at this tango workshop in Hamburg, Germany, last weekend?
Poor boy, did he manage to fix it? Have you been there at La Yumba, @opendoor ?
I don't want to guess the age of his partner - just saw the picture on facebook.

 

[pianistamediano]

What might have gone wrong at this tango workshop in Hamburg, Germany, last weekend?
Poor boy, did he manage to fix it? Have you been there at La Yumba, @opendoor ?
I don't want to guess the age of his partner - just saw the picture on facebook.

View attachment 5449

That's a strange collection of knick-knacks and assorted miscellanea for a dancer to collapse into...

 

[opendoor]

...Have you been there.

They do it every year. I attended some years earlier and found that rather I am the expert!

 

[TTanguero]

What might have gone wrong at this tango workshop in Hamburg, Germany, last weekend?
Poor boy, did he manage to fix it? Have you been there at La Yumba, @opendoor ?
I don't want to guess the age of his partner - just saw the picture on facebook.

View attachment 5449

Hmm, I guess you can pause for too long after all

 

[JournalInTime]

Two hours later, had a great Biagi/Duval tanda (not the more cheerful/romantic ones, think it started with Triste Comedia and ended with Alguien) with another follower, who listened and danced to his piano. Maybe it's just where I dance or whom I dance with, but I find it uncommon that followers listen and dance well and precisely (this is the important part!), specifically to those absolutely delicious piano solos, even if I let them have the moment.

I love such moments! It also ties into something I've been working on with my coach since forever:

There's a school of thought that the leader listens to and interprets the music, while the follower receives the music from the leader. In this picture, the follower either doesn't listen to the music at all (I've actually people say things like, "The follower could be dancing with earplugs.") or listens to it strictly for cues for ornaments. I've never liked this view. My coach despises it.

My coach's alternative:

Tango: The leader interprets the music with leads and with leader ornaments. The leader's ornaments – which can be extravagant, up to and including uncommunicated steps – must not disrupt the follower's dance. The follower interprets the music with how they dance leads, with follower ornaments, and – when the leader opts not to lead (as in a suspension or a deliberate effort to give the follower space to play) – with fully unled movements. The follower's movements must not disrupt the leader's dance.

Vals: As in tango, above . . . but in addition, the follower has the job of being the metronome, and their interpretations, ornaments, and unled play must mark the 1 in 1-2-3, whatever else they do. "Must not disrupt the leader's dance" is intensified to "Should aid the leader's dance by marking the strong note."

Milonga: The leader interprets the music with both leads and leader ornaments. The follower primarily follows the leader, not the music. However, they still interpret the music in ornaments and deliberate spaces to play. Both dancers still must not disrupt other's dance.

I watched a whole lot of videos. As it happens, professional performers do the above when improvising rather than dancing choreographies. Whether you want to do it socially is a choice, but I tried it actively last night and got far more complements than usual about musicality. Setting aside disrupting the other's dance, which is obviously bad, it's pretty clear that (1) most followers hate being "pulled off the 1" in vals, and (2) most followers fall out of synch at milonga speeds if it isn't the leader they're dancing to.

 

[itwillhappen]

There's a school of thought that the leader listens to and interprets the music, while the follower receives the music from the leader.

Just last weekend:
Me: "Oh my dear, come into my arms, we've to dance a repair tanda. You seem to be broken, I've never seen you dance out of the music like you did on the tanda before this."
She: "Did I lead or did he lead?!"

 

[pianistamediano]

In this picture, the follower either doesn't listen to the music at all (I've actually people say things like, "The follower could be dancing with earplugs.") or listens to it strictly for cues for ornaments.

Ugh. On one hand, I've had perfectly enjoyable tandas with followers who didn't do anything that I didn't lead. But they still were musical. On the other, I find that it's generally much more enjoyable when a follower listens to the music, and interprets my lead according to it. The absolute best tandas I've had (tangasmic, one could say) were with active followers, who never once interfered with my lead, but placed their personality and musicality into every movement. And yet the feeling of entregarse remained ever-present. But it's a fine line between interpretation and interfering with the lead, so I can understand why not that many followers do it.

Tango: The leader interprets the music with leads and with leader ornaments. The leader's ornaments – which can be extravagant, up to and including uncommunicated steps – must not disrupt the follower's dance. The follower interprets the music with how they dance leads, with follower ornaments, and – when the leader opts not to lead (as in a suspension or a deliberate effort to give the follower space to play) – with fully unled movements. The follower's movements must not disrupt the leader's dance.

I'm in full agreement with all this. Oftentimes, when I feel (from how she responds to my lead, any hesitation or even any body language that might indicate nervousness or inexperience) that my partner cannot follow precisely some complex musical phrase, I dance that phrase with my feet while leading her to the main rhythm, or the top-level melody.

Vals: As in tango, above . . . but in addition, the follower has the job of being the metronome, and their interpretations, ornaments, and unled play must mark the 1 in 1-2-3, whatever else they do. "Must not disrupt the leader's dance" is intensified to "Should aid the leader's dance by marking the strong note."

This I'm less sure about. I have a metronome already in my head from all the years of practising the piano, and always marking the first beat seems restrictive. But I can easily see how it might feel good, though, since the vast majority of valses place an emphasis on the first beat of most bars, and it's just natural. To give two examples (not necessarily counterexamples to your point) of valses that are more complex musically than usual:


There is a 2:3 polyrhythm in two phrases (from 0:57, and from 2:02). I recall that I have played with syncopation (stepping on the second beat instead of the first), stepped on each of the two beats per bar, continued with the usual vals rhythm, stepped on 1 and 3 or 2 and 3. But it takes a very musical follower to follow some of these, let alone recognise the polyrhythm.


Again, the 2:3 polyrhythm.

Milonga: The leader interprets the music with both leads and leader ornaments. The follower primarily follows the leader, not the music. However, they still interpret the music in ornaments and deliberate spaces to play. Both dancers still must not disrupt other's dance.

Yes. When dancing con traspie, or double time, or the syncopation, given the overall greater tempo, there is so much precision involved that there is generally less space for the follower.

There's a school of thought that the leader listens to and interprets the music, while the follower receives the music from the leader.

This is interesting, since it has commonalities with my own personal view.

I dance the same way I play the piano. I become the music, and I give the music to my partner. Or at least that's what I strive towards. So I give myself to my follower; this is what entregarse means for me. But in the same way different pianos feel and sound different and need differing playing techniques to obtain a desired texture or sound, I listen and adapt constantly to my follower. If a follower does not listen to the music enough, does not give anything back, merely receiving the music, then it is the same as playing a cheap toy piano.

In the same way I prefer playing on Steinways, which have beautiful tone colour and a rich sound and feather-light actions, I very much prefer followers who are extraordinarily sensitive and musical and active, who sing with their bodies. But I long to play on Bösendorfer and Fazioli pianos someday, and I grew up with Yamaha pianos, so I enjoy dancing with other types of followers too.

 

[pianistamediano]

Although I might be overdoing the minimality of my lead and also musicality! The follower who danced that Biagi tanda with me mentioned that my lead was subtle, but she was getting used to it. And just earlier today, my teacher told me I needed to feel more present for the follower, since she was basically making educated guesses as to what I was leading (they were all correct, but I guess that says more about her than me.) The only time I really do that is when the music really moves me and is more intense - say, La Yumba or Pobre Flor.

Also, that my head was too in the clouds at times. I guess the rest of the time, even when I feel the music strongly, I don't want to do anything that feels incoherent with the music - say, when there's an absolutely delicious piano part in something like Biagi's Lágrimas y Sonrisas or Paloma. And being that strong with my lead feels wrong. Although strength might be the wrong word; it's clarity that I should be focusing on.

So I think I'll keep working on the clarity of my lead, and being more grounded, since I know my precision is already there, and my musicality is monstrous. I'm getting to the point where it's the smaller things that will really let me make breakthroughs in my dancing and development of my own style.

 

[ArbeeNYC]

There's a school of thought that the leader listens to and interprets the music, while the follower receives the music from the leader.

That sounds rather odd. I've never heard that before.

 

[ArbeeNYC]

And being that strong with my lead feels wrong. Although strength might be the wrong word; it's clarity that I should be focusing on.

Well, it's more like making sure you follow the compás energetically enough to actually be able to let your partner know what your doing. Directed energy more than strength. And the energy has to be distributed throughout your body. Old-school milongueras really want to feel you move, they want to feel the energy in your arms and hands. And, reciprocally, you feel their energy as well. I love dancing with women who dance that way. So, yes, clarity is very important. If you're going to take a step, make sure she knows you're taking the step, even if it's a short one.