Enough Classes

Peaches said:
I don't see how the two things are mutually exclusive. Of course the student is paying for help in improving, for which the teacher receives compensation. That doesn't mean the teacher isn't guiding (if teaching isn't guiding, I don't know what it is), and it doesn't mean that there aren't other benefits and motivations present, as well.
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I don't know that everyone goes to a private lesson with the same goals and expectations. Sometimes, I take privates with a rather general goal (like trying to lead more clearly and smoothly), while other times I'm trying to learn a specific step or sequence.

If my goal is more general, I'm much more receptive to the teacher going off on a tangent, but if the goal is more specific, then I want to stay on topic. Of course, my stress level (prior to the class) can be a factor as well, which is why I no longer will schedule a private after I get off from work.
 
Shandy said:
I totally agree with your comment and I hope I can explain to opendoor why I allowed it to continued. I didn't feel the 20 minutes was wasted, which is why I didn't feel the need to change it when I realised what was happening.

On the positive side: In this section of my lesson, I was being given (to me) something completely new without any demonstration from the teachers. I had to completely trust and follow. Often I surprised myself (and them) on what I DID get but just as often it highlighted gaps in my understanding.

The technque section of my lesson could then work on either the gap in my understanding that was highlighted, or develop the new technique/feel/musicality etc. that was being highlighted in the sequence.

The final section of my lesson would always be a positive experience because I could always bring something of the last 45 minutes to our free dancing. With the teachers being good enough to include the "lesson learnt" in a different way so I could understand and own the lesson outside of the "sequence" taught.

These lessons may not suit everyone but in certain circumstances they would be highly recommended. My only difficulty with the lesson is the boredom it generates at the group class, when its repeated over two nights. I hear the same comments as in my private lesson plus I can clearly see how they've developed the teaching from the problems generated in my lesson.

At first I derived pride now its boredom - something that wouldn't happen in a large vibrant AT community but in a small beginner/improver community that's how I feel.
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It looks to me that you had great lessons indeed, but not enough opportunity to apply, develop, further the skills you got from it. Not enough action in one's own community is a very common problem.
Alas, short of living in Buenos Aires, one has to travel or/and be very patient, passionate and creative to keep his/her tango alive and progressing.
 
After allowing the teacher free-rein for my first private - which left me feeling powerless and that I'd not learnt stuff I wanted to learn I now suggest a 20-20-20 split for an hour's lesson. I state this clearly at the beginning and if the teacher couldn't work like that I wouldn't be repeating the experience.

20 mins trouble-shooting and basic technique
20 mins whatever the teacher wants - usually more of the same, refining, honing, applying
20 mins more advanced stuff and pushing my limits, often something I've identified for myself as difficult

It's worked so far. I've compared notes with people who've had lessons with the same teachers and realised that the ground covered is often similar. But then, dancers often have similar faults in technique and teachers usually have a bee in their bonnet about certain aspects of technique, so that doesn't surprise me.

But I'd be really cross if I felt my lesson had been used as a testing ground for their lesson material! I pay to get ME time!
 
Madahlia said:
But I'd be really cross if I felt my lesson had been used as a testing ground for their lesson material! I pay to get ME time!
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To be fair, I do often get material in privates which I then cover in group classes. But I never teach routines or sequences in a private, so the "material" will usually be common areas of technique problems that come to light. And I certainly don't use a private as a practica, or as a rehearsal. I agree, that is out of order. (actually, I don't really teach routines in group classes, thinking about it. Unless ochos / giros are routines...)

Private classes, to me, should be exploratory and cooperative, not dictatorial - at least, beyond a certain point. At the beginner level, private classes are actually less useful I think; the right group classes are probably more effective.
 
I don't take classes now because I am always occupied during early evenings when classes are held. I go to late-night milonga and always have a good time dancing tango. However, I am often questioned why not attending classes, particular if a leader learned that I haven't danced AT for over a year. I feel ashamed then, as if I am not really qualified of being at the milonga, that I am not a serious student.
 
Hey, welcome to DF.
AT isn't just for "serious students", although you can be made to feel that way.
If you are having a good time and people continue to ask you to dance and there is no blood on the dance floor, don't beat yourself up.
 
LoveTango said:
I don't take classes now because I am always occupied during early evenings when classes are held. I go to late-night milonga and always have a good time dancing tango. However, I am often questioned why not attending classes, particular if a leader learned that I haven't danced AT for over a year. I feel ashamed then, as if I am not really qualified of being at the milonga, that I am not a serious student.
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Yeah, what Steve said. Just go and have fun. If people are dancing with you, then you must be doing something right.

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Thank you, Steve, thank you, dchester, for your welcoming notes. I have tons of questions and often get confused with various and often contradictory information. I am now going through the earlier threads to see if I can find answers to my questions.

I just happened to come across an earlier thread, where both of you have mentioned being corrected by followers. I have exactly the same experience, from some inexperienced leaders (but thought they knew better). When it happened at a class, the teacher would square the issue right away. but if it happens at a Milonga, then I just have to "correct" myself for that specific leader. Often I can tell which advices are needed, and will take in full heartedly. I like your quote, dchester. I could be that fool who is so certain at certain time, though often I am the one with doubt to my ability.
Thank you again, for the warm welcome to a newbie. :)
 
LoveTango said:
...am not a serious student
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hi compañera, you do not need to take classes, and you do not need to be ashamed at all! There are so many ways to learn tango! I (f.i.) started to learn on my own, for I felt absolutely overchallenged by the traditional way of learning by watching the instructor. I never danced before, so I could not bank on anything and my mirror-neurons were not trained at all. So I ran out of my second class and went to milongas for three years. I got very well integrated in that community and danced with really experienced girls from the very beginning on. So I could ask: what about my pacing, what about my axis, what about bobbing, what about... and so on. And all that feedbacks helped me further on. (So! thank you all you splendid milongueras!) I set my own objectives: step by step I built up my own tango curriculum. And after 5 years I began to seek a teacher. I found a former ballerina and began to work hard again. First it was kind of a deconstruction of almost everything I´ve done before, after that my second tango curriculum began... (and so on, still under construction). By now I am going to teach, got a class of 5 couples and I hope I am a teacher (in the full sense of meaning), not a instructor.
 
opendoor said:
... By now I am going to teach, got a class of 5 couples and I hope I am a teacher (in the full sense of meaning), not a instructor.
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That's very impressive. I am almost the opposite. I take in lessons quickly. My first teacher taught me enough to get me started. Then I start getting advices here and there, so I become the product of contradictory teaching. I think every once in a while, I should take a private lesson to tune up my technique and get things re-aligned. The problems is now that I get more exposed to the AT world, don't even know how to define a good teacher.:(
 
I stop taking classes unintentionally. My teachers decided to stop giving lessons.
There were just a few of us regular on the classes and practicas so IMO it's better that we don't have ones but we'll having workshops, don't know when.

I have strong basis about technique so I can explore with follower in my community.
I will watch videos and advanced dancer and try to perform elements that look alike.

@LoveTango
AT is so special cause it's so personal. Every dancers moves differently.
At first learn from ones source and when you get comfortable with your body explore that with other teacher and feel what is the best for you.
Learning from other teacher might be contradictory at first, but you also have dancers that have different style so you will be able to adapt better.
 
LoveTango said:
The problems is now that I get more exposed to the AT world, don't even know how to define a good teacher.:(
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I define it that teacher shows you how to feel and be more comfortable in performing various elements. :notworth:
That respects that your natural is not teacher's natural.

Teacher should be able to explain body dynamics and put into a practice.
All done in relaxed way.
 
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